Rebranding Followup

eltito

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Apr 21, 2014
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Thats fair... :) And with respect I think you're argument is weak and possibly maybe even (edited)

I'm going to get hated today... lol but thats ok as long as its good for Darkcoin because that is where my heart is, you are a founder and you want the same name as the rothchilds? and others ... What is going on here? Is this a coincidence?
I'm not sure that particular association is one we need to worry about bringing the sky tumbling down on us.

Taking a step back, however, it seems to me that you're primarily concerned with differentiation in the market space. Our disagreement is on how all-encompassing the market space is. Sure, there are variations on the name Dash in the financial sector, but like I said, that's a pretty wide net to cast. In he transportation sector, for example, you can buy a Volvo station wagon or a Volvo 18-wheeler. I somehow doubt the company has trouble with consumers who can't differentiate between the two.
 
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r-ando

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R-ando! Is in Canada! Holy shit... We could use more people with your attitude up here sometimes. We're usually way to polite. ;) Damn!
Hahaha I'm actually one of the most polite Canadians you have ever met probably. Asking questions and challenging others opinions is often seen as something that shouldn't be done these days...
I'm not sure that particular association is one we need to worry about bringing the sky tumbling down on us.

Taking a step back, however, it seems to me that you're primarily concerned with differentiation in the market space. Our disagreement is on how all-encompassing the market space is. Sure, there are variations on the name Dash in the financial sector, but like I said, that's a pretty wide net to cast. In he transportation sector, for example, you can buy a Volvo station wagon or a Volvo 18-wheeler. I somehow doubt the company has trouble with consumers who can't differentiate between the two.
Yes differentiation... unique brand name for recognition, how many cokes and pepsi are there out there... 7 of each? No 8!


The transportation sector, really? Is it a different company that makes both of them...? Your saying the volvo station wagon is competing against the 18-wheeler for recognition? I agree eltito
 

darkred

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Feb 6, 2015
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Just in case we're looking for possible combinations based on the DRK letters, we can use something like this possible words:

$ grep -i "^d.*r.*k$" /usr/share/dict/words
(that came up with 50 words to review)

Running this on a mac, there are only 235k words (and it is english-based - it might be better to use a global dict with other languages)
$ cat /usr/share/dict/words | wc -l
235886

Or if we want 4 letter words... (there are 4347 of them)
$ grep -e "^[a-z][a-z][a-z][a-z]$" /usr/share/dict/words | wc -l
4347

Four letter words beginning with "d":
$ grep -e "^d[a-z][a-z][a-z]$" /usr/share/dict/words | wc -l
229

If we look at most recent hip startup-like names we could pick a 6 letter word, that ends with 'er' but drop the 'e'
$ grep -e "^[a-z][a-z][a-z]er$" /usr/share/dict/words | wc -l
417

It feels like we want:
- prefer a two-syllable, pronounced word/phrase (would consider three syllables)
- easily pronounced (without something like latex where you say it lay-Tech because the X is the letter Chi)
- something not used so we could trademark it and get URLs easily (avoid ecash, iPay, visa, etc.)
- possibly a common phrase or word, but not necessary
- three to 6 characters long (possibly longer) - (examples: dash, dawn, darpa, etc.)
- we (perhaps just moi) tend to think of only english words, but that might be holding us back; we should consider searching other languages: German, Italian, Dutch, Spanish, French, Afrikaans, Hindi, Portuguese, Finnish, Zulu, Bengali, etc. - there might be some interesting words that could be used
For instance, "mani" (Hindi), "dinero" (Spanish), "geld" (Dutch/Afrikaans/German) , "monon" (Esperanto), "imali" (Zulu), "pecunia" (Latin), etc.
Google translate is a big help here... for the monoglots amongst us.
- if we can re-use D, R, and K, then we could keep a tie back to darkcoin - something like:
DrK (Doctor K's)
"digital redbacks"
"digital redbucks"
"dollar Kryptos" etc.
"Arkcoin", the 'd' is silent (lol)
- there seems to be a preference to starting with 'd'
- should feel/seem a direct competitor to 'bitcoin', 'visa', 'mastercard', 'american express', 'paypal', 'apple pay', 'debit card', etc.
- should not have 'dark' in the name (to sound less nefarious)
- preferably does not have a negative connotation/association (like 'badcoin' or 'shitcoin')
- we may not want 'coin' in the name
- for some reason, we tend to be using either green or blue for logos, perhaps that could be incorporated like "Skycoin" or "Oceans" (using blue)
- our receiving/sending addresses start with 'X', perhaps we incorporate that into the name (like Xpay or Xrouting)
- we may want a bland word/name (not everyone agrees though) OR we may want an "edgy" name
- we want the name to inspire quick/fast/instantaneous type associations
- we could use some combination/play off the words/technology that we like so much:
- darksend, instantX, mixing, crypto, coin, cash, anonymous, digital, masternodes, nodes, liberty, currency, Evan, Duffield
for example (not a good one), 'dmix' - digital masternodes instantX

Hope that helps with the creative juices...
 

ErrorId

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After reading the last couple of pages I'm starting to think "Dash" might be more trouble then its worth. I'm certain Evan didn't skimp on the lawyer and I hope that they have our best interest in mind and not how many hours they can bill. I'm a little worried about what would happen should someone decide to press on us for trademark infringement? Large companies sometimes shake the tree for no other reason but to see what falls out, has anyone thought about how we would fight what could be an army of lawyers? There's a lot more to this then meets the eye.
 

r-ando

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Please try to find a unique name for a unique Darkcoin if you change the name.

Don't worry about play on words or other nonsense that successful entities don't worry about... play on words don't create or hold value.

Especially if you can't put a moat around it.
 

r-ando

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Exactly the opposite, actually. The same way that we aren't competing with any of the companies you listed earlier.
wrong eltito, you are competing to see who will put a moat around it first. There are a lot of other concepts that are more complicated too, but I'm having enough trouble explaining this one for now, its the essential.

Additionally if you choose Dash you decide to run that competition against the Rothschilds and directly put yourself in front of their lawyers... You think your foundation lawyer is better than the team they will send in a private jet, 3 lawyers, 6 assistants if they decide to do that...uh what... Why would you even put yourself in the remotest possibility of such action against darkcoin?
 

Minotaur

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After reading the last couple of pages I'm starting to think "Dash" might be more trouble then its worth. I'm certain Evan didn't skimp on the lawyer and I hope that they have our best interest in mind and not how many hours they can bill. I'm a little worried about what would happen should someone decide to press on us for trademark infringement? Large companies sometimes shake the tree for no other reason but to see what falls out, has anyone thought about how we would fight what could be an army of lawyers? There's a lot more to this then meets the eye.
We could just get abatement insurance later on, if we wanted. That is pretty standard practice in tech. Although I am not as worried as you guys seem to be.
 

NewJack

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Aug 25, 2014
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At first I had reservations about the name "Darkcoin," for the very reasons Evan outlined. However, shortly thereafter I changed my mind.
To me it seems that Darkcoin has staked out a valuable niche already in a crowded field, anonymity. This IS what all the first adopters want. To take advantage of InstantX and whatever else, you need actual users. The first users are going to be people that want privacy, pure and simple. It is the thing that will make someone unfamiliar with crypto-currencies, adopt.

To me, it seemed like Darkcoin was generally gaining value when Bitcoin was declining in value in the past few months. I thought this was a big deal. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
Evan mentioned that businesses were shy because of the name. Well, maybe the wrong businesses were approached. I can see music sites adopting Darkcoin, events, various teen and twenty-something aimed products and services. Essentially the market that made Bitcoin, big. And let's face facts: Bitcoin wouldn't be as big today if it wasn't for Silk Road and the publicity that generated. Get out of the trees and look at the forest. The average person needs a good reason to adopt. They don't care about fast transactions, they don't even know it's an issue. We do, they don't. They care about privacy - something they can't get elsewhere, or at least not very much.

Big businesses and corporations will adopt Darkcoin when they see it has users. At that point no one cares what it's named. Well, more precisely, that might be the time to change the name if you need too. But not now. Don't mess with the core early adopters. That's a mistake. When 7-11 or Costco says they'll use Darkcoin if it's named "Dash" that's the time to change. Not before.
 

ErrorId

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We could just get abatement insurance later on, if we wanted. That is pretty standard practice in tech. Although I am not as worried as you guys seem to be.
The only reason I bring these things up is because I want this project to succeed. I believe it can change the world. As to being worried, yeah, I am. Don't forget who and what crypto is up against and what it represents. They will use every dirty trick in the book and then some should Evan's creation become even a minor threat to their empire.
 
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Mast

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Mar 11, 2015
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If Dash is chosen; I own the dashcointalk org and com, message me if interested.
 

g8F98FF3gjafogj4

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I swear to jeebus I have only the highest opinion of eltito. But it is starting to itch a little bit that after not having seen him at all for 6 months he seems to be in-the-know, while vertoe was totally blindsided. I really appreciate what the foundation brings as far as being a tool to make legal purcahases and act like an entity etc, but... vertoe. :(
 

tungfa

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I swear to jeebus I have only the highest opinion of eltito. But it is starting to itch a little bit that after not having seen him at all for 6 months he seems to be in-the-know, while vertoe was totally blindsided. I really appreciate what the foundation brings as far as being a tool to make legal purcahases and act like an entity etc, but... vertoe. :(
easy easy
these 2 things have nothing to do with each other

eltito was always in the 'loop' as he is the secretary at the foundation meetings !

the vertoe story is different (+ sucks, and apologies were expressed already)
 
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r-ando

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Just a thought to break up the seriousness for a second:

If this re-brand goes through, to "Dine and DASH" will suddenly become respectable!

:D
Hahaha, I have to say I love your positive attitude Tao it is really is awesome, thanks for that one...
 
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souptacular

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I swear to jeebus I have only the highest opinion of eltito. But it is starting to itch a little bit that after not having seen him at all for 6 months he seems to be in-the-know, while vertoe was totally blindsided. I really appreciate what the foundation brings as far as being a tool to make legal purcahases and act like an entity etc, but... vertoe. :(
I felt the same way. I have talked to foundation members who assured me that Evan not asking him to be involved in the dash discussion was unintentional and they have apologized on the forums. They hate that he is gone, but at the same time he didn't stick around long enough to give his side of the story. Because of this, I have no choice but to trust in the facts rather than speculation of the reason he was not involved. In my mind, unless anyone can prove differently or vertoe speaks, the foundation took the steps to apologize and try to retain him as a Dev and vertoe ignored them and sold his coins. This does not excuse the way he was ignored, but apologies were had and he felt the need to bolt so we have to work with what the reality of the situation is and not get too involved in speculation.
 
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r-ando

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easy easy
these 2 things have nothing to do with each other

eltito was always in the 'loop' as he is the secretary at the foundation meetings !

the vertoe story is different (+ sucks, and apologies were expressed already)
I'm glad Eltito is back, the more the merry-er! :)
 

Boss

New Member
Mar 12, 2015
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Why not call it, DST-Coin
Decentralized Swift Trade - Coin
or
Decentralized Intelligent Swift Trade - Coin

The name is not taken, and it fits with the Darkcoin. Any thoughts? :oops::rolleyes::cool:


DTC/BTC

BTC/DTC
 
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moli

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easy easy
these 2 things have nothing to do with each other

eltito was always in the 'loop' as he is the secretary at the foundation meetings !

the vertoe story is different (+ sucks, and apologies were expressed already)
Where's the apologies?
 

moli

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you want an apology ?
NO, i care less. I'm just curious you know there were apologies but the rest of the community don't.
So when are we going to have transparent communication between you guys and us?
 

tungfa

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NO, i care less. I'm just curious you know there were apologies but the rest of the community don't.
So when are we going to have transparent communication between you guys and us?
i think whatever happened (example) with vertoe
has nothing to do with the community or me or you

this is between evan and vertoe direct !
nothing else !

transparent communication ?
i think if anything evan is 'king' of transparency,
sure mistakes were done, as in any company or community
and they will happen again (be sure)
 
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souptacular

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NO, i care less. I'm just curious you know there were apologies but the rest of the community don't.
So when are we going to have transparent communication between you guys and us?
EDITED:
After thinking more about this post, Tungfa convinced me to take a chill.pill, lol. You can see my reasoning about 8 posts after this one.

ORIGINAL POST:
fernando Minotaur eduffield

I am heading a lot of feedback from individuals and IRC about how vertoe leaving was handled. I know foundation members have elaborated on apologies for how they handled the communication of DASH, but vertoe departing is not a small thing in the scope of the development and the many widely used tools he has contributed too. If appropriate, could anyone elaborate without getting too gossipy about who or how vertoe was contacted after he made it clear he was upset in the forums (and then promptly left). I believe that would clear up a lot of anger in the community (as for me, I am content with the foundations answer, but that is from private convos between various community members).
 
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souptacular

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i think whatever happened (example) with vertoe
has nothing to do with the community or me or you

this is between evan and vertoe direct !
nothing else !

transparent communication ?
i think if anything evan is 'king' of transparency,
sure mistakes were done, as in any company or community
and they will happen again (be sure)
It isn't that simple tungfa. Vertoe was a respected Dev for DRK and there are indications people have picked up on that things transpired between the team and him that caused him.to leave. I personally believe he got fed up with the disagreements he had with the decisions being made and left. That is fair, for both him and the community, he has that choice. You need to look at his commit history, his multiple projects related to improving darkcoin and rethink how you communicate about his departure. Many long time highky supportive members just want clarification on what went down.
 
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tungfa

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where is this paranoia suddenly coming from the 'the foundations knows, and they are hiding something'

nonsense !
this has NOTHING to do with the foundation,
i am a member like everybody else

i had my talk with evan, and sure everybody else in the Dev Team had
"regrouping" i would call this !
foundation ?! no idea what they are doing !

some people are riding some strange vibes here suddenly
what is going on, evan is evan, DRK is DRK
we trusted before and still will
as nothing changed !

I think there are so weird rumours going around on IRC
(feeding the fire eh)
as i got some direct messages with the strangest allegations !
We are NOT chitin something ... remember !
We are still DRK and NOTHING changed !
 
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moli

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i think whatever happened (example) with vertoe
has nothing to do with the community or me or you

this is between evan and vertoe direct !
nothing else !

transparent communication ?
i think if anything evan is 'king' of transparency,
sure mistakes were done, as in any company or community
and they will happen again (be sure)
I understand. I just wish someone could help Evan to connect things together.