Pre-Proposal Discussion: Dash to fund Tezos

Would you like dash to fund Tezos in order they instantiate dash in their platform?


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demo

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Apr 23, 2016
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I have no doubt about the concepts, sandboxing etc, but the politics and slow pace is ridiculous
An amazing revolutionary project, which deals with big money, it is expected to have big problems.
Many enemies are going to attack it, because many things are going to change and many people are going to lose their status quo, in case this project succeds.
This project has devoted friends ....



....and rabid enemies!!
 
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UdjinM6

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This thread turned into discussion about Tezos and their problems instead of being a pre-proposal, moving to "Alternative Currencies"
 
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demo

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This thread turned into discussion about Tezos and their problems instead of being a pre-proposal, moving to "Alternative Currencies"
Everybody has to admit this. The fact that Dash never raised an Initial Coin Offer , gives to Dash a moral advantage.

Unless of course you consider as ICO the conspiracy theory claiming that stupids and spies bought masternodes in order to stop Dash's governance.This kind of subsidy cannot be proved of course, but everybody has to agree that a project baked by dollars is much worst than a project baked by bitcoins or ethereum. The dollar guys are considered much more evil and greedy than the ethereum or the bitcoin ones.
 
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demo

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Some people are pissed off by the lawsuits, and started tezos libre
https://ipfs.infura.io/ipns/QmT7A5yRJ1AMRUCXV6Ct2GvXxSbfWHHs7LCgm2kTFhsxbq
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1 Introduction
"Nothing is stronger than an idea whose time has come"
- Victor Hugo

Tezos is a great idea whose time has come: we believe in a self-governing, trustless, fully decentralized digital commonwealth.

Now that Tezos Stiftung is regaining its operational capacity, we shall prepare for serious attacks against us.

2 Problem
"Free competition enforced by law is a grotesque contradiction in terms"
- Ayn Rand

We drew a lesson from the struggle of the last months: old tools and legacy institutions are not compatible with a disruptive, decentralized paradigm shift.

We see two completely different worlds that cannot meet: the old system versus the new, centralization versus decentralization and self-governance.

We are aware of government agencies already investigating Tezos France, Tezos Stiftung and Tezos developers individually.

A state actor could easily coerce them into steering Tezos toward their agenda, forcing them to use their explicit powers (eg veto, big voting stake) and their implicit ones (eg the trust of the community).

These entities could force their way into our commonwealth and eventually manipulate, revert, censor or stop smart contracts that threaten their monopolies.

3 Solution
We believe that, in order to be antifragile, Tezos needs to be resilient to any attacker, including government agencies and state actors.

To achieve that, "Schelling fences" should have been created to ensure social consensus on non-negotiable rules such as:

  • liquid development team (no leader, pseudonymous developers, etc)
  • voters equality (eg no veto rights, no premined stakes)
  • tx immutability (no tx should be censored or manipulated)
  • contract immutability (no contract shall ever be stopped or manipulated)
  • pure on-chain governance (no hard forks)
  • capped inflation rate
  • 100% free software
  • and more …
As Tezos investors and believers, we want to minimize the risk of the Tezos vision being hijacked by a powerful attacker.

4 Tezos Libre
We believe the best way to realize the grand Tezos vision is to have multiple teams work toward a decentralized digital commonwealth, using different strategies but with a common goal.

Last but not least, we recently became aware of Tezos Stiftung being willing to fully enforce its charter by supporting the development of multiple Tezos implementations.

This is why we forked the existing Tezos code and created Tezos Libre. We are currently defining our operational priorities before launching Tezos Libre in production.

5 Coopetition
We believe in "coopetition": cooperative competition. Both implementations of Tezos, DLS-Tezos and Tezos Libre, will have their own place in the market.

Free market coopetition will make both projects stronger in multiple ways:

  • strategic hedging: more resilience against state actor attacks
  • codebase sharing: more development teams sharing code with each other
  • easier experimentation and evolution
We want Tezos to be strong, trustless, decentralized, immutable, uncensorable and - ultimately - unstoppable. We believe in individual action, and we're doing our part.

Join us on Telegram http://t.me/tzlibre and get involved!

The team, 2018-02-23
 

GrandMasterDash

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haha, tezos forking, the very thing it was designed to avoid! The whole project is a mess.
 

demo

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haha, tezos forking, the very thing it was designed to avoid! The whole project is a mess.
There is no surprise. Everything evolved exactly as expected.
A nomic bank is always attacked by fiat money holders and fiat money proponents.
This is what history shows.
Big ships, big challenges....:rolleyes:
 

demo

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haha, tezos forking, the very thing it was designed to avoid! The whole project is a mess.
@GrandMasterDash

Tezos is coming

14
Dash $2.010.053.232 $245,18 $159.900.000 8.198.209 DASH 4,96%

18
Tezos $1.396.204.212 $2,30 $4.265.270 607.489.041 XTZ * 5,15%


But some issues regarding aml/kyc (similar to here, once upon times) occured there.

<vote history><-- why vote history is usefull?
Would you like dash to fund Tezos in order they instantiate dash in their platform?
yes 1 vote(s) 5.9%

no 15 vote(s) 88.2%


other 1 vote(s) 5.9%

</vote history>
 
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GrandMasterDash

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Jul 12, 2015
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@GrandMasterDash

Tezos is coming

14
Dash $2.010.053.232 $245,18 $159.900.000 8.198.209 DASH 4,96%

18
Tezos $1.396.204.212 $2,30 $4.265.270 607.489.041 XTZ * 5,15%


But some issues regarding aml/kyc (similar to here, once upon times) occured there.

<vote history><-- why vote history is usefull?
Would you like dash to fund Tezos in order they instantiate dash in their platform?
yes 1 vote(s) 5.9%

no 15 vote(s) 88.2%


other 1 vote(s) 5.9%

</vote history>
Has "some" issues is an understatement. Am happy with my decisions to avoid both eos and tezos. Meanwhile, decred has been rising through the ranks.

As for dash, at the moment, I think the pros outweigh the cons. I therefore expect it to return to the top ten, so long as it gets something out this year and doesn't under deliver. The namespace thing is a major concern though. No one cares for yet-another-username and adding a novel payment structure will not save it. It has to be more than that.
 

demo

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perhaps we should wait and see if it is successful for others before funding anything.
If it is succesful for others, maybe it will be too late for Dash.
It is urgent for Dash to invest in research in both the governance and the anonymity fields.
Despite some issues regarding aml/kyc compliance (similar issues to here, once upon times) Tezos (which invested severely in governance research) is still getting closer and closer to dash.
14
Dash $1.995.727.928 $243,18 $149.239.000 8.206.861 DASH -11,24%
17
Tezos $1.290.847.388 $2,12 $3.003.740 607.489.041 XTZ * -0,99%

 
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benhxahoihaiphong

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Apr 27, 2019
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Tezos? Another thing I have not heard of before. Do they have a good reputation? How long have they been around? Looking at their website... Interesting logo, I like that. It also says on their website: "Tezos is currently testing and bug fixes to move out of its prototype phase. We are scheduling to release Tezos in Q1 2017." - perhaps we should wait and see if it is successful for others before funding anything.
 

vazaki

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Jan 27, 2019
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Tezos? Another thing I have not heard of before. Do they have a good reputation? How long have they been around? Looking at their website... Interesting logo, I like that. It also says on their website: "Tezos is currently testing and bug fixes to move out of its prototype phase. We are scheduling to release Tezos in Q1 2017." - perhaps we should wait and see if it is successful for others before funding anything.
Read here. They changed their protocol in the runtime. This is a very interesting technology.
https://medium.com/@tezoshop/a-review-of-the-voting-public-bakers-fbbc22758dd7

Another advantage is their smart contract language.
Tezos creates a platform for smart contracts in the original sense: not as code for a world computer, but as a way to enable transactions. At the same time, Tezos’ blockchain language, Michelson, is Turing complete and formally specified, and can support a wide variety of different use cases.
Changing the protocol in the runtime and having a smart contrat language that focuses on transactions (rather than focusing on world computing that ethereum does), are very inovative ideas.

The disadvantages of Tezos is that their community is not as active as Dash's community is. And also that they comply to AML/KYC.


13 Dash DASH $1.232.091.759 $139,80 8.813.453 $384.537.415 0,63% 4,34% 15,79%
14 Tezos XTZ $1.092.396.751 $1,65 660.088.777 * $7.028.787 0,46% -0,41% 30,83%

here’s an example of a Michelson smart contract, as provided by Milo Davis. It locks up an amount of tez until a specific time, after which it sends the tez to the contract on file.

Code:
parameter unit;
storage (pair timestamp (pair tez (contract unit unit)));
return unit;
code { CDR;          # Ignore the parameter
       DUP;          # Duplicate the storage
       CAR;          # Get the timestamp
       NOW;          # Push the current timestamp
       CMPLT;        # Compare to the current time
       IF {FAIL} {}; # Fail if it is too soon
       DUP;          # Duplicate the storage value
       # this must be on the bottom of the stack for us to call
       transfer tokens
       CDR;          # Ignore the timestamp, focusing in on the
                       transfer data
       DUP;          # Duplicate the transfer information
       CAR;          # Get the amount of the transfer on top of
                       the stack
       DIP{CDR};     # Put the contract underneath it
       UNIT;         # Put the contract’s argument type on top of
                          the stack
       TRANSFER_TOKENS; # Make the transfer
       PAIR}         # Pair up to meet the calling convention
The above smart contract code could be used if you would like to bind a representative with some money, so that if he does not acts/votes/behaves as you ordered him, he will lose his money.

I dont know how Dash could implement a contract like the above.
 
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vazaki

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Why are you bumping this thread @vazaki ? Are you planning to put in a proposal? This thread is 3 years old now.
Yes... I would like Tezos to instantiate dash in their Tezos platform. And see what will happen, and how the dash community would vote for the dash protocol to evolve. But I have not 5 dash available to put this as a proposal into the dash budget system.
 

vazaki

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Are you planning to put in a proposal? .
Additionaly, now that the hard fork and split problem has been somehow resolved by the governed cryptocurrencies, I would like to see crypto-communities which have similar type of government and share similar values to merge eachother. Dash and Tezos have the same type of governence, they are both plutocracies (or hybrid plutocracies, after the implementation of voting delegation). So why not the two communities to merge eachother (based on their current market value) and create a bigger community and a bigger coin? After the arrival of the governed coins (with Dash being the first one), merging cryptocurrencies will be the next big thing into the crypto space. Let Dash be also the first coin that will merge with other coins.

I would like to ask this government question into the dash budget system, but unfortunately the government questions are expensive.
 
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vazaki3

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AlexRider

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Judging from the fact that Tezos is aimed at combining a self-correcting protocol and operational management to manage network changes, and in general it is a multi-purpose platform that supports dApps. I think so, it would be appropriate for Dash to fund Tezos.
 
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