Development Update - Oct 1, 2014

Ignition75

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Based on my cost analyzation that's not bad. Especially considering how some people are claiming that the mining can be improved upon by 400%.
It's not 400% mate, it's more like double for Nvidia cards. I'm still getting some figures for AMD, the likes of djm and Wolf0 think there's plenty of gains to be had on the AMD side as well.
 

Ignition75

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$2,380 Masternode is cheaper than $10,000 Neptune that won't even pay for itself. The masternode is money itself, and doesn't need to pay for itself when it can simply be cashed out if needed.

Low barrier to entry achieved.

Mining is already a thing that you can do only if you can afford ASICs. MNs are available to anyone with the DRKs, and you get them back no matter what...
That's why I sold 20 rigs and converted them to Masternodes. I still have 10 left, I'm not sure what to do with them. I still want to mine but I can't decide between 750ti, 970s, keep the Toxics or wait for the new AMD chips.
 

aethlios

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Aug 31, 2014
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What will happen if the usd cost of running a masternode is higher than the revenue from a MN??? If btc hits 120 usd in 3 months and drk goes a lot lower then will the MN holders run the MNs in a loss?? You can't pay MN running costs in drk, you need usd. For how long will MN holders run the MN's in a usd loss. Will they start dumping?? and reducing the price of drk and the reveneu of the MNs left behind???
 

oblox

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Aug 6, 2014
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What will happen if the usd cost of running a masternode is higher than the revenue from a MN??? If btc hits 120 usd in 3 months and drk goes a lot lower then will the MN holders run the MNs in a loss?? You can't pay MN running costs in drk, you need usd. For how long will MN holders run the MN's in a usd loss. Will they start dumping?? and reducing the price of drk and the reveneu of the MNs left behind???
No one knows, but there will be a point where they stop the VPS and perhaps just park their coins if it becomes unprofitable. Nothing says BTC can't go lower and DRK up.
 

thelonecrouton

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What will happen if the usd cost of running a masternode is higher than the revenue from a MN??? If btc hits 120 usd in 3 months and drk goes a lot lower then will the MN holders run the MNs in a loss?? You can't pay MN running costs in drk, you need usd. For how long will MN holders run the MN's in a usd loss. Will they start dumping?? and reducing the price of drk and the reveneu of the MNs left behind???
It's a self balancing system, same as mining. And there's at least one VPS provider (flokinet) that takes DRK, and plenty take BTC, no need for $'s.
 

TsuyokuNaritai

Active Member
May 24, 2014
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What will happen if the usd cost of running a masternode is higher than the revenue from a MN??? If btc hits 120 usd in 3 months and drk goes a lot lower then will the MN holders run the MNs in a loss?? You can't pay MN running costs in drk, you need usd. For how long will MN holders run the MN's in a usd loss. Will they start dumping?? and reducing the price of drk and the reveneu of the MNs left behind???
Eventually, some of them will. This is one of the many reasons why it's naive to think that short term price & adoption don't matter. Just because Evan is awesome & DRK is the most innovative coin out there, that doesn't mean it will even have a chance to capitalize on Instant Transactions if by the time it comes out some clonecoin with ninja marketing skills behind it has permanently cornered the network effect. Anyone who thinks the best, most technologically superior coin is bound to win in the end, just take a look at where litecoin still is and ask yourself why.

It's a self balancing system, same as mining. And there's at least one VPS provider (flokinet) that takes DRK, and plenty take BTC, no need for $'s.
It will self-balance, as in all the masternodes won't just quit & kill the coin [Edit: because when they quit, the remainder get a larger share], but their numbers would still be greatly reduced which would damage the coin. That VPS provider that takes DRK will still be pricing in govpaper.
 
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MangledBlue

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Man - what a good read :)

Everybody bickering back and forth - healthy discussion(s) (sarcasm of course)
Some nice coding from Evan
I see this as a move to remove some more "weak" hands

Even if BTC drops to USD$100, DRK will still live on....
Some people (weak hands) will move out and move on - buh bye....
I'll still be here....

I'd love to fire up my mining rigs again but, most of the time I'm to poor to pay the electric from mining because I refuse to sell ANY DRK....
I have a JOB (just over broke) and I make due with what I have - like.....
Running a MN with my DRK...
I do have a fellow investor and would love to take on a few more investors
So if you folks that are DRK poor and plan on staying for a LONG-TIME - hit me up....
All you do is collect the DRK at the end of the month and I run everything
No weak hands should apply - just got rid of 1 weak-hand - ugh

Evan has years of financial experience and, from what I can tell, NOBODY here can even rival... and
Thing is folks - Evan has a plan...
Holy shit - he can code - WOW!!! (more sarcasm)

As Evan stated, Mining is not going ANYWHERE - but over time, miners will get paid less...
This is also a part of the LARGER scheme of things that none of us really understand just yet......yet.
Would love to see all of you face-palm when the NEW stuff comes out and everybody is like - - Oh! Well - of course, now I see it.

And for those of you that are to poor to Mine....
You have mining rigs right in front of you - DUH!!!

Go into your wallet
Help
Debug
Console
(enter the following command)
setgenerate true -1
(for 100% CPU)
setgenerate true 1
(for a single core, etc etc)
setgenerate true n

To stop minging
setgenerate false

To see the mining
getmininginfo

Nobody can bitch and moan that they cannot afford mining hardware - you're here aren't you??
You all have mining hardware right in front of you and the software to run it.
You might not earn much but it takes time...... try it :-D

Some of this is a bit out of date but.....
https://darkcointalk.org/threads/a-how-to-with-the-qt-wallet-part-three.1723/

LONG LIVE DRK
E PLURIBUS OBSCURUM
IN DRK WE TRUST


edit: still hoping this happens :p

http://imgur.com/1iLWz4o.png
 
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AjM

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Man - what a good read :)

Everybody bickering back and forth - healthy discussion(s) (sarcasm of course)
Some nice coding from Evan
I see this as a move to remove some more "weak" hands

Even if BTC drops to USD$100, DRK will still live on....
Some people (weak hands) will move out and move on - buh bye....
I'll still be here....

I'd love to fire up my mining rigs again but, most of the time I'm to poor to pay the electric from mining because I refuse to sell ANY DRK....
I have a JOB (just over broke) and I make due with what I have - like.....
Running a MN with my DRK...
I do have a fellow investor and would love to take on a few more investors
So if you folks that are DRK poor and plan on staying for a LONG-TIME - hit me up....
All you do is collect the DRK at the end of the month and I run everything
No weak hands should apply - just got rid of 1 weak-hand - ugh

Evan has years of financial experience and, from what I can tell, NOBODY here can even rival... and
Thing is folks - Evan has a plan...
Holy shit - he can code - WOW!!! (more sarcasm)

As Evan stated, Mining is not going ANYWHERE - but over time, miners will get paid less...
This is also a part of the LARGER scheme of things that none of us really understand just yet......yet.
Would love to see all of you face-palm when the NEW stuff comes out and everybody is like - - Oh! Well - of course, now I see it.

And for those of you that are to poor to Mine....
You have mining rigs right in front of you - DUH!!!

Go into your wallet
Help
Debug
Console
(enter the following command)
setgenerate true -1
(for 100% CPU)
setgenerate true 1
(for a single core, etc etc)
setgenerate true n

To stop minging
setgenerate false

To see the mining
getmininginfo

Nobody can bitch and moan that they cannot afford mining hardware - you're here aren't you??
You all have mining hardware right in front of you and the software to run it.
You might not earn much but it takes time...... try it :-D

Some of this is a bit out of date but.....
https://darkcointalk.org/threads/a-how-to-with-the-qt-wallet-part-three.1723/

LONG LIVE DRK
E PLURIBUS OBSCURUM
IN DRK WE TRUST


edit: still hoping this happens :p

http://imgur.com/1iLWz4o.png
Thx for info MangledBlue.
Just started single core mining, to see it works.
 

MangledBlue

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That's the spirit!!!
It only takes one at a time.....

Distribute the Hash one core at a time.

Like a drip - we can soon fill the bucket :)
 

MangledBlue

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I can see the Crypto-Headlines now.....

DARKCOIN BRINGS QT SOLO-MINING BACK
CPU DISTRIBUTED MINING MAKES A COMEBACK

It's all about the hash and keeping the coin protected. Darkcoin is asking it's community to contribute a single CPU core or more, within the Qt wallet to protect the blockchain. While there have not been any recent threats to the DarkCoin blockchain, community members are being asked to contribute, at the least, a single CPU Core to strengthen Darkcoin.

Over the next few days, Darkcoin will convert to, what is know as, Enforcement. With Enforcement, a revolt of derelict pools is possible. This potential revolt gives rises to a possible unintended fork for DRK. If enough Pool Power decides to over take the, soon to be had, MasterNode Enforcement, Pools could take matters into their own hands and literally kill Darkcoin.

If DarkCoin can muster enough support from the commuity, said support could ultimately push Darkcoin, above and beyond it's required 90% and/or 3 week interim of Masternode Payment Enforcement. It would be the first time, in history, that a solo-miner effort, over took a much larger pool, such as GASHIO and the other un-named factions of decent.

Early results show, little response from the DarkCoin community but Evan Duffield has been called upon to assist. By adding solo-mining to the face of the Darkcoin Qt. User's would have instant access to combat any derelict acting Pools, as a whole, at will.
 
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splawik21

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Apr 8, 2014
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Me to 50% but of 4cores ;)
Anyway if someone hit the block halleluia if not it is good idea to support the nethash .
 
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Stealth923

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eduffield - I know theres been alot of talk lately about MN dynamics & other exciting upcoming projects, but I think we really need to take action with respect to enforcement as a first step and some of the other imo important pieces that have been lingering for a while:

1) Enforcement
2) GUI upgrade to the wallet - We need to find someone to continue the great work that DRKLords already completed.

I am not sure what your hesitation is to flip the switch - we are at 80%+ compliance now but I have missed 5 MN payments in the last 2 days, and I am sure others are in the same boat!!

Talk about enforcement has been ongoing for months with zero action to follow. Can we please set a date in concrete and follow through?

Thanks for the great work you have been doing :)
 
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crowning

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May 29, 2014
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eduffield - I know theres been alot of talk lately about MN dynamics & upcoming projects, but I think we really need to take action with respect to enforcement as a first step.

I am not sure what your hesitation is to flip the switch - we are at 80%+ compliance now but I have missed 5 MN payments in the last 2 days, and I am sure others are in the same boat!!
Even when I'd love to have it switched ON now, Evan already set a date and it would be highly unprofessional to change it after that:
https://darkcointalk.org/threads/rc5-launch-mandatory-update.2443/
 

Stealth923

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Even when I'd love to have it switched ON now, Evan already set a date and it would be highly unprofessional to change it after that:
https://darkcointalk.org/threads/rc5-launch-mandatory-update.2443/
Great - if a hard date was set rather than just "3 weeks" that would be more reassuring. As I previously said, talk about enforcement has been lingering since RC3/4

Also an update as to if the GUI wallet upgrade is going to happen if at all would be good!
 

acidburn

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If we don't do it right we could end up with a hard fork and the miners could revolt. In that case they'd kill the coin and we'd be doomed.
 

thelonecrouton

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If we don't do it right we could end up with a hard fork and the miners could revolt. In that case they'd kill the coin and we'd be doomed.
Miners aren't going to kill anything, although they might suffocate themselves under the weight of their delusions of individual indispensabilty.
 

moli

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Miners aren't going to kill anything, although they might suffocate themselves under the weight of their delusions of individual indispensabilty.
Are you back again with your half assed argument? Evan was one of the first miners. Miners brought DRK into this world. Are you telling Evan to go f himself now or what???? I'm sure he's still mining DRK. Miners were the first to bring DRK into value as a currency, where was MN at the early stage? Sure eventually when all darkcoins are mined, mining will be the thing of the past, but we are not there yet. At this stage, it would be best if you spend your time to get drk to be adopted in the real world, as we still have a lot of work to get this done.

This is a currency, not a toy for you to buy and show off. Miners have been doing their job in marketing this coin, what have masternode holders done to get people to know and buy this coin? If there's no buying and selling, if people do not use this coin, it will be a dead coin. Masternode system is important for InstantX and Darksend, but masternode holders aren't the only key players in this, esp. for someone like you who has done nothing but trying to devalue miners who are important key players in building this coin. So, please stop your ugly posts on here.
 
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thelonecrouton

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Are you back again with your half assed argument? Evan was one of the first miners. Miners brought DRK into this world. Are you telling Evan to go f himself now or what???? I'm sure he's still mining DRK. Miners were the first to bring DRK into value as a currency, where was MN at the early stage? Sure eventually when all darkcoins are mined, mining will be the thing of the past, but we are not there yet. At this stage, it would be best if you spend your time to get drk to be adopted in the real world, and we still have a lot of work to get this done.

This is a currency, not a toy for you to buy and show off. Miners have been doing their job in marketing this coin, what have masternode holders done to get people to know and buy this coin? If there's no buying and selling, if people do not use this coin, it will be a dead coin. Masternode system is important for InstantX and Darksend, but masternode holders aren't the only key players in this, esp. for someone like you who has done nothing but trying to devalue miners who are important key players in building this coin. So, please stop your ugly posts on here.
I said, "individual indispenability."

I'm a miner as well as a MN op, there are many like me. Like it or not, MN tech with InstanTX is relegating miners to a backup role in maintaining the blockchain. I view this as progress, and rejoice. :)

Saying that I "have done nothing but devalue miners" is ludicrous. Miners have been devalued by a faster and cheaper solution: Masternodes - and it's Masternode tech that gives value to DRK both now and in the future.
 

camosoul

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Sep 19, 2014
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Eventually, some of them will. This is one of the many reasons why it's naive to think that short term price & adoption don't matter. Just because Evan is awesome & DRK is the most innovative coin out there, that doesn't mean it will even have a chance to capitalize on Instant Transactions if by the time it comes out some clonecoin with ninja marketing skills behind it has permanently cornered the network effect. Anyone who thinks the best, most technologically superior coin is bound to win in the end, just take a look at where litecoin still is and ask yourself why.
And DOGE...Ridiculous crapcoins, both of them, but nobody knows any better... Advertising is all that really matters to cryptotards. They comprehend nothing.

This has been my concern from the beginning. Being the smartest guy on Earth doesn't matter if everyone else is a dumb animal.

DRK can be flawless in every way, but if nobody is able to understand it, they won't and can't care about that which they lack the ability to understand...
 
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camosoul

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I said, "individual indispenability."
This is my Neptune. There are many like it (which are equally useless for the coin it was made for), but this one is min[e](ing DRK on xpool.ca)... Will it manage to turn a profit even there? Probably not. It probably won't even pay for itself unless there is adoption. And, adoption lies int he hands of cryptotards who have no hope of ever understanding anything at all about what they throw their money into...

This is my bank of MNs. There are many others like them, but these are also mine... I can cash them out and never worry about whether they turn a positive ROI or not. They don't have to pay for themselves to redeem their cost. They also deserve to make a lot more money than my already unprofitable miners, because they do much more for the network than the miners do.

Both are useful and necessary, one simply moreso than the other. The more useful one also carries a much lower risk...
 
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Captain_Tom

New Member
Oct 3, 2014
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This is what happens when people who don't understand what's going on get a keyboard...

Fewer DRKs == higher value for an already scarce coin... Mining was satoshi's experiment. It works, but it's not the only metric we should be using. Money hosers who don't understand how it works will get mad. They should sell their rigs to people who do understand, just like traders who don't understand fundamental software development should sell their coins so I can buy them...
So then this really is all about getting MN owners rich isn't it? You know MarineCoin tried that scarcity for the 1% thing and it really didn't turn out well (Surprise! /s).
 

Captain_Tom

New Member
Oct 3, 2014
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Eventually, some of them will. This is one of the many reasons why it's naive to think that short term price & adoption don't matter. Just because Evan is awesome & DRK is the most innovative coin out there, that doesn't mean it will even have a chance to capitalize on Instant Transactions if by the time it comes out some clonecoin with ninja marketing skills behind it has permanently cornered the network effect. Anyone who thinks the best, most technologically superior coin is bound to win in the end, just take a look at where litecoin still is and ask yourself why.



It will self-balance, as in all the masternodes won't just quit & kill the coin [Edit: because when they quit, the remainder get a larger share], but their numbers would still be greatly reduced which would damage the coin. That VPS provider that takes DRK will still be pricing in govpaper.
Exactly - to everything you said. Stop worrying about short-term profits, and focus on making the best long term coin possible.
 

TsuyokuNaritai

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Exactly - to everything you said. Stop worrying about short-term profits, and focus on making the best long term coin possible.
That's exactly what I wasn't saying.

It does sound nice on the surface, like something a smart, level-headed, loyal supporter would say, that everyone should nod their heads and agree with to sound wise and a team player. But there's the way life ought to be, then there's the way life actually is.

The unpleasant and annoying fact is that if we were to neglect short term adoption and value in the hope that everything would work out when our amazing new breakthroughs are released, then when that day comes around we'd find some PR-genius market-savvy shitcloners had already made themselves the default anon coin and captured the network effect to the point where we couldn't take back the momentum no matter how superior the technology.
 
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Kai

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eduffield How about keep the MN reward at 20% and on top of that share x% of the transactions' fees between all the up-and-running masternodes (because at one point, post beta, almost all transactions will go through them).

Better incentive IMO and with the future Masternode Security it will be difficult for bad actors to put offline other MN to get a bigger share.
 
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raze

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Cross-posted from BitcoinTalk:
JCMiner said:
It seems to me like we have the same people defending increasing the current 20% MN payments and a much larger set of people against it. I have been a DRK supporter since early February and I haven't had this bad of a feeling about something Evan suggested since that airdrop idea he floated...

I still don't know why we don't give the currency several months to a year to grow organically before messing with the technicals. If DRK/fiat increases then MN's will become more profitable and their numbers will naturally increase. The current plan is heavy handed and may well be a disaster if too many people are pissed off.
Agreed 100%. I too have been here since February and can't help but think of the airdrop idea in relation to this. I think it's premature to start worrying about the Masternode count this early in the game (especially considering the current market climate). I'm neither a miner nor a Masternode operator so I have no "side" really, but I can't help but think that raising the percentage is trying to fix a problem that doesn't really exist yet. The suggestion of trustless Masternode pooling seems like a less risky and controversial means to start trying to boost the Masternode count, at least in the near term.
 
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moli

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Cross-posted from BitcoinTalk:


Agreed 100%. I too have been here since February and can't help but think of the airdrop idea in relation to this. I think it's premature to start worrying about the Masternode count this early in the game (especially considering the current market climate). I'm neither a miner nor a Masternode operator so I have no "side" really, but I can't help but think that raising the percentage is trying to fix a problem that doesn't really exist yet. The suggestion of trustless Masternode pooling seems like a less risky and controversial means to start trying to boost the Masternode count, at least in the near term.
I'm not a miner either and currently not a MN op, though I could be. And I agree there's something serious in this proposal that takes me back to take a good look at DRK and where it's going. I trust that Evan is doing the right thing so we'll see. At least he didn't decide abruptly to cut off all miners and give MN 100% profit and centralize the whole thing... If that ever happened we could expect a big revolt and big DoSSes until Darkcoin goes under? Investors need to watch this closely now?!
 
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patrolman

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I'm not a miner either and currently not a MN op, though I could be. And I agree there's something serious in this proposal that takes me back to take a good look at DRK and where it's going. I trust that Evan is doing the right thing so we'll see. At least he didn't decide abruptly to cut off all miners and give MN 100% profit and centralize the whole thing... If that ever happened we could expect a big revolt and big DoSSes until Darkcoin goes under? Investors need to watch this closely now?!
Are you saying that Masternodes are centralised? Or just to support your opinion in this case?
 

g8F98FF3gjafogj4

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Are any of these scaredy-cats going to respond to snogcel's post?
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=421615.msg9086284#msg9086284

...Keep in mind Evan has stated he plans on having InstantX within a few months...

Snogcel's post:
I've taken a few days to really think hard about the changes in the future for POW and Darkcoin... it really does feel like a well thought out plan, it's just that you have to look at it in the context of InstantX... first read:

https://www.scribd.com/doc/24101213...hanism-for-Mitigating-Double-Spending-Attacks

Bitcoin uses proof of work to maintain consensus throughout its network of peers. Due to its technical parameters this limits the speed at which a transaction can be considered confirmed and safe against double spend attacks.

To decrease the time a transaction needs to be confirmed it’s possible to lower the block generation time. which has the drawback of blockchain bloat and has a lower boundary of ~30 seconds due to network latency.

We are proposing to combine the proof of work algorithm with an implementation of a distributed lock manager (DLM) which will utilise the masternode network: Transaction Locking.
Once finalized and deployed, POW serves as a much slower "backup" to the DLM method. To support transaction locking, a robust network is required - and - logically, as the Masternodes will be doing all of the actual 'work'... doesn't it make sense to adjust the distribution of block reward to provide incentive for that network?

Code:
+ if(nHeight > 150000) ret += blockValue / 20; //25%
+ if(nHeight > 150000+((576*30)*1)) ret += blockValue / 20; //30%
+ if(nHeight > 150000+((576*30)*2)) ret += blockValue / 20; //35%
+ if(nHeight > 150000+((576*30)*3)) ret += blockValue / 40; //37.5%
+ if(nHeight > 150000+((576*30)*4)) ret += blockValue / 40; //40%
+ if(nHeight > 150000+((576*30)*5)) ret += blockValue / 40; //42.5%
+ if(nHeight > 150000+((576*30)*6)) ret += blockValue / 40; //45%
+ if(nHeight > 150000+((576*30)*7)) ret += blockValue / 40; //47.5%
+ if(nHeight > 150000+((576*30)*9)) ret += blockValue / 40; //50%
+ if(nHeight > 150000+((576*30)*11)) ret += blockValue / 40; //52.5%
+ if(nHeight > 150000+((576*30)*13)) ret += blockValue / 40; //55%
+ if(nHeight > 150000+((576*30)*15)) ret += blockValue / 40; //57.5%
+ if(nHeight > 150000+((576*30)*17)) ret += blockValue / 40; //60%
60% for the preferred method (DLM), 40% for the auxiliary and slower method (POW). I think the fallacy lies in the term "payment" - it's a distribution of block reward based on service provided to the network.

What if down the road 95% of transactions bypass the POW network entirely? It will be funny looking back on this thread when the roles are reversed and MN owners are complaining about POW "payments" ;-)