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Proposal: Reimbursements For Acquisition And Setup Of Dashtalk

Cool, yea I understand that it comes down to the people that are owed back. I know they are just in it, but I think that is because they are fighting with evolution in marketing for the remaining funds. I for one have voted down this proposal, not because I don't agree with it but just because I want to see evolution in marketing start now. If this proposal came back with a split payment then it would get the up vote from my masternodes.
I do also understand that there are others that could be contacted but it wouldn't be as easy for them as their budgets are smaller so a split into two payments still wouldn't give the budget enough room to include evolution in marketing.

Thanks for contacting them, I will await to hear the reply.
 
Thanks babygiraffe for pinging me on this. I'll respond myself because more than 95% of that proposal is to reimburse me.

I was in charge of negotiating this handover. I suggested to accept this price because I really thought it was a fair one. To make it more clear that I believed in this deal, I said I would advance the funds myself. I really think one must put his wallet where his mouth is. I even said that at this price I would buy this personally if the team didn't want it and I wasn't bluffing. The proposal would have to be a reimbursement one because it had to be closed fast.

I thought the community would be happy about this because many people had complained about the forum and I was convinced the price was fair. I'm a mod here, so I have received many of those complaints and I know! However, I clearly misread the situation because the proposal has a ton of no votes and it doesn't look like it is gonna pass (at 9% atm). Even when it looks like it is going to pass, it has a very low lever of support (I think it has never gone over 11-12%).

Because of this lack of support, I don't want to split it. It would introduce too much uncertainty for me.

If it goes through, that is fine because that was the plan. I will transfer the domains to the foundation and we'll setup adds with revenue also going to the foundation.

If it doesn't, I'm in a weird situation. I didn't make any reservations and I have almost zero leverage. The database is in place to move everything to forum.dash.org, server and domain that I don't own. The only thing I would have is the old domains, which we plan to redirect to forum.dash.org so no links are lost. However, given that I have paid for it, I think I have a legitimate claim to at least be given the right to manage the ads myself and try to recover my investment. I haven't talked about this with the team yet because I didn't have a plan B, but I hope we can get into a reasonable agreement. It is more complicated that that because other people have worked/are working a lot to make this happen (especially moocowmoo and tungfa). If this turns into a private enterprise they should get compensated somehow too. I have also been approached by someone well know here, offering to co-invest and help manage this if the proposal doesn't go through, so I think it could work. It looks like I'm not the only one that thinks this is a good price. This was not my plan and I depend on others accepting it. I would prefer my masternode back.Those funds are/were an important part of my holdings. But I'm ok if this is the final outcome.

However, if I split and the second and/or third payment don't go through, I'm in the middle of nowhere and the situation is even more complicated. The argument that this month is special doesn't make sense. Every month there are more proposals than funds and the competition will only increase. If there are difficulties this month, next month will probably be worse. So I either get reimbursed or I try to get into an agreement with the team, but things in the middle would be too complicated.

Btw, I find it interesting that in the few moments when this proposal has gained more votes that Dash World people ask me to split it so that proposal gets paid in full. Nobody has talked about splitting DW so this one gets paid when DW has more votes and this one was over 10%. Or even when this one had more votes and they were over 10%. I understand that DW is a multi-month one and it has already been adjusted in amount to account for the price increase, but still I find it a bit unfair that I'm the only one asked to compromise. Anyway, it looks like DW is passing and this one is not, so no need to talk about this any more :smile:
 
Thanks babygiraffe for pinging me on this. I'll respond myself because more than 95% of that proposal is to reimburse me.

I was in charge of negotiating this handover. I suggested to accept this price because I really thought it was a fair one. To make it more clear that I believed in this deal, I said I would advance the funds myself. I really think one must put his wallet where his mouth is. I even said that at this price I would buy this personally if the team didn't want it and I wasn't bluffing. The proposal would have to be a reimbursement one because it had to be closed fast.

I thought the community would be happy about this because many people had complained about the forum and I was convinced the price was fair. I'm a mod here, so I have received many of those complaints and I know! However, I clearly misread the situation because the proposal has a ton of no votes and it doesn't look like it is gonna pass (at 9% atm). Even when it looks like it is going to pass, it has a very low lever of support (I think it has never gone over 11-12%).

Because of this lack of support, I don't want to split it. It would introduce too much uncertainty for me.

If it goes through, that is fine because that was the plan. I will transfer the domains to the foundation and we'll setup adds with revenue also going to the foundation.

If it doesn't, I'm in a weird situation. I didn't make any reservations and I have almost zero leverage. The database is in place to move everything to forum.dash.org, server and domain that I don't own. The only thing I would have is the old domains, which we plan to redirect to forum.dash.org so no links are lost. However, given that I have paid for it, I think I have a legitimate claim to at least be given the right to manage the ads myself and try to recover my investment. I haven't talked about this with the team yet because I didn't have a plan B, but I hope we can get into a reasonable agreement. It is more complicated that that because other people have worked/are working a lot to make this happen (especially moocowmoo and tungfa). If this turns into a private enterprise they should get compensated somehow too. I have also been approached by someone well know here, offering to co-invest and help manage this if the proposal doesn't go through, so I think it could work. It looks like I'm not the only one that thinks this is a good price. This was not my plan and I depend on others accepting it. I would prefer my masternode back.Those funds are/were an important part of my holdings. But I'm ok if this is the final outcome.

However, if I split and the second and/or third payment don't go through, I'm in the middle of nowhere and the situation is even more complicated. The argument that this month is special doesn't make sense. Every month there are more proposals than funds and the competition will only increase. If there are difficulties this month, next month will probably be worse. So I either get reimbursed or I try to get into an agreement with the team, but things in the middle would be too complicated.

Btw, I find it interesting that in the few moments when this proposal has gained more votes that Dash World people ask me to split it so that proposal gets paid in full. Nobody has talked about splitting DW so this one gets paid when DW has more votes and this one was over 10%. Or even when this one had more votes and they were over 10%. I understand that DW is a multi-month one and it has already been adjusted in amount to account for the price increase, but still I find it a bit unfair that I'm the only one asked to compromise. Anyway, it looks like DW is passing and this one is not, so no need to talk about this any more :smile:

whow
that was not the plan that this gets so complicate !!
I am very surprised by the vote (for now as well) , honestly Fernando give this a couple of days more before making any decisions please . there are still a bunch of votes missing in general and as always this still can turn ether way !
a problem these days is that people want to fit too many proposals into the budget and are pokering around with what 'should be in or not'
just wait for a bit , this will all sort itself out as whoever has any overview of this project knows how important dashtalk (and its data ) is to us all
 
whow
that was not the plan that this gets so complicate !!
I am very surprised by the vote (for now as well) , honestly Fernando give this a couple of days more before making any decisions please . there are still a bunch of votes missing in general and as always this still can turn ether way !
a problem these days is that people want to fit too many proposals into the budget and are pokering around with what 'should be in or not'
just wait for a bit , this will all sort itself out as whoever has any overview of this project knows how important dashtalk (and its data ) is to us all
Of course, I am not making any decision because the ball in on voter's roof. I'm just explaining how I see it because I'm getting hit by request to split this in different places. I would prefer if things go the way we had planned!
 
Of course, I am not making any decision because the ball in on voter's roof. I'm just explaining how I see it because I'm getting hit by request to split this in different places. I would prefer if things go the way we had planned!

no worries brother F
no need for any compensation here, in case you and.... run that thing i am happy to back you wherever i can
i just want to get that page started and done, the rest will fall in place :wink:
 
I think we should use "Improvement of DASH public awareness" funds to reimburse fernando losses for getting forum under control again. Keeping 2 year old forum data and a seamless migration of it I think is way more important and urgent than any other thing under this ("Improvement of DASH public awareness") proposal.
 
I agree about not splitting it. That would be awkward if part went through and part didn't, more awkward than it is now.

FWIW, I first thought it was too much but after reading the details I support your decision.
 
fernando i wanted to say I wasn't pushing for a split just so DW could pass. In fact I was kind of sad to see dashtalk not passing as its my personal opinion that this is currently the best new proposal made by the core team. DW is already broken down into 4 months. I would say split that but it doesn't really make sense either.

If dashtalk doesn't pass I've got 100 dash toward reimbursement for you guys. I know it's not much but every bit counts.

I think we should use "Improvement of DASH public awareness" funds to reimburse fernando losses for getting forum under control again. Keeping 2 year old forum data and a seamless migration of it I think is way more important and urgent than any other thing under this ("Improvement of DASH public awareness") proposal.

I would support this also.
 
fernando i wanted to say I wasn't pushing for a split just so DW could pass. In fact I was kind of sad to see dashtalk not passing as its my personal opinion that this is currently the best new proposal made by the core team. DW is already broken down into 4 months. I would say split that but it doesn't really make sense either.

If dashtalk doesn't pass I've got 100 dash toward reimbursement for you guys. I know it's not much but every bit counts.



I would support this also.
No need for it buster. But thanks for offering, I feel really humbled for the help offers I have got. I fucking love this community :smile:
 
fernando:

You have advanced your funds on more than one occasion to help Dash, as I recall. However this vote goes, I just want to thank you for that.

P.S. I hope that even if this doesn't pass, you would consider resubmitting next month. I would suggest that if you submit it very early, it will likely gain enough traction to be unassailable by the end of the month. (Early in the month, there will be fewer proposals to compete with and a longer voting period which will result in more votes. Without any reason to vote preferentially for other proposals which do not yet exist, nearly all those extra votes will likely be 'yes.')
 
fernando I think there is a competition going on right now between your reimbursement and the Dash World proposal. I think you have a lot more support than is showing. It's just that the people that want Dash World in this budget are probably going to down vote this proposal due to only one being able to make it. That is why I suggested to split the proposal up, as it would then avoid the competition for the remaining budget funds. I think you would have a lot more votes by doing so but that is your decision.
 
I've been thinking about this for a bit and I do think the masternode network should find a way to fully pay back the missed budget. It just doesn't send a good message that an error occurred and the DASH network is not attempting to correct it.

There is also the issue of what caused this error to happen in the first place. Was Evan the only person who knew that there needed to be some kind of manual initialization for the budget to be paid? Was this a failure that could be attributed to the entire core team? I would hate to ask the core team / DASH foundation to help chip in because they are already not getting paid very much by the network, but in the end the ball was dropped and it is not fair for just one person who was not even responsible to foot the bill. Wherever we get the funds from, we also need to make sure that this never, ever, ever happens again. Can you imagine if an entire month's budget were to be missed a couple years from now with a budget many times this size? Nightmare. So I hope this is being addressed in the protocol development, we don't want to have to rely on an initialization that has to be started by a person.
 
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I've been thinking about this for a bit and I do think the masternode network should find a way to fully pay back the missed budget. It just doesn't send a good message that an error occurred and the DASH network is not attempting to correct it.

There is also the issue of what caused this error to happen in the first place. Was Evan the only person who knew that there needed to be some kind of manual initialization for the budget to be paid? Was this a failure that could be attributed to the entire core team? I would hate to ask the core team / DASH foundation to help chip in because they are already not getting paid very much by the network, but in the end the ball was dropped and it is not fair for just one person who was not even responsible to foot the bill. Wherever we get the funds from, we also need to make sure that this never, ever, ever happens again. Can you imagine if an entire month's budget were to be missed a couple years from now with a budget many times this size? Nightmare. So I hope this is being addressed in the protocol development, we don't want to have to rely on an initialization that has to be started by a person.

that is all fixed by now + baby giraffe is now in "charge" of all budgets !
 
i think there is a lot of strategic voting going on where people vote no on this (one-time) budget proposal
to protect their own competing budget proposal. I hope this budget proposal makes it and Fernando gets reimbursed.
To those people strategically voting no just remember that in a few months 12.1 will be out and all budget proposals will have to be reset then anyways.
 
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i think there is a lot of strategic voting going on where people vote no on this (one-time) budget proposal
to protect their own competing budget proposal. I hope this budget proposal makes it and Fernando gets reimbursed.
To those people strategically voting no just remember that in a few months 12.1 will be out and all budget proposals will have to be reset then anyways.
There is definitely strategic voting going on. This has a lot more support than is showing but unfortunately its either this reimbursment or Dash World. I am sure if this was split into 2 payments then it would fly through. If not then I am sure it would pass next month when more of the budget is available.
 
that is all fixed by now + baby giraffe is now in "charge" of all budgets !

How was it fixed (link to post?), and what does it mean for BG to be in "charge" of budgets? If it is still dependent on a human for initialization then IMO it still needs work.
 
How was it fixed (link to post?), and what does it mean for BG to be in "charge" of budgets? If it is still dependent on a human for initialization then IMO it still needs work.

This was all discussed months ago in another thread on these forums. At present somebody has to send a command to finalize the budget...anybody can do it. Right now Ryan apparently sees to that, backed up by several team members. IIRC Evan is working on automating it.
 
I tell you what, voting this month is difficult! I found myself voting "No" on proposals I might support in other months, just because I support others even more.

I just wanted to note that this is one of those proposals I support "even more." A solid, long-running forum is essential at this stage of a crypto's life cycle. I know that when I first started really exploring Dash, this forum was incredibly valuable. To stabilize it would be a good use of funds.

I would also support using public awareness funds for this if necessary; in my opinion this forum is currently the best public awareness project we have.
 
This was all discussed months ago in another thread on these forums. At present somebody has to send a command to finalize the budget...anybody can do it. Right now Ryan apparently sees to that, backed up by several team members. IIRC Evan is working on automating it.

Yes that is my understanding as well. Having a system where we are very careful to make sure that it is manually done is definitely needed as long as it is still manual, but I wouldn't call it fixed until it is automated. Evan mentioned that it should be worked on but there haven't been any updates
 
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