DASH mining in any capacity is officially dead

Do you see current DASH algorithm as unsustainable in terms of scalability?

  • Yes

    Votes: 6 42.9%

  • No

    Votes: 8 57.1%
  • Total voters
    14
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Vedran Yoweri said:
he, at least we don't go on forums complaining, reeking of butthurt and blaming others for our errors. ;)
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Of course the dash community blames the masternode owners.
You are not more than 400 people, you own 4000 masternodes, and 4.000.000 dash.
The rest 3.500.000 dash owners (who are by far more than 400 people) complain to you, because YOU govern, not us!
 
As a conclusion, I believe that a hard fork should be done, that will give voting power to more actors. The masternode owners proved themselves incompetent.

I remind to the miners my proposition back in Jan 15, 2017 . Why the miners didnt support it? The stupidity of the masternode owners must be proved mathematically. And if after the proof they keep denying to give voting power to the rest of us, then a hard fork is inhevitable.

We , the 3.500.000 dash owners, we are the Dash community. The masternode owners are either a bunch of idiots or a bunch of spies (most of them, not all), and as such we should either educate them or spit them out of Dash's body and confiscate the dash they own.
 
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Checkerama said:
Thanks for the patience - I've whipped up a quick article based on our conversation to really convey the problems I am seeing with the algorithm and how it fails to incentivize a worldwide, decentralized, mining adoption. Check it out:

https://medium.com/@aquilesgomez/hi...11-algorithm-on-the-dash-network-f48533a5e6fe
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You should compare btc pay out and hashrates when it’s first ASICS came out those miners lost usd then to. I remember because I bought the 200 go Avalon and the bitmain s1 at 180 gh. Sadly the first gen ASICS for any coin except script you seem to loss your money on. I also bought the grid seeds when they came out I made rob in like 6 or 9 months.
 
Oh I forgot butterfly labs the ran off with a lot of btc and never delivered. U should look at btc,s difficultly back in 2013 when comparing it to dash that’s when the ASICS hit.
 
But most early miners such as my self thought of it as a hobby not as a way to live off of. Maybe it would become something and provide a return but it was a really cool project to play with. I think the next gen x11 miner will bring a decent roi. I am sorry that people didn’t understand the first gen ASICS kill difficulty all the time. I mean when the s2 came out thier were cries by the s1 crowd when s3 came out s1 and s2 cried and so on. I mean mining isn’t an instant pay off ever.
 
- It is not possible to compare different algos and its hashrate. Such comparison means nothing.
- Unprofitable mining does not mean that coin have any problems with scalability. Dash network will generate new block in 2.5 minutes and no matter how many miners will join or leave the network. Just difficulty will be reajusted.
- You cannot blame in this situation anyone but yourself. You was too greedy and did not do math before you buy miners.
- Same situation happened in bitcoin network several times. For example when first asics emerged but some guys already invested in GPU farms. In that time there were no much profitable altcoins and they thought they just lost money. Many of them sold their equipment but many other smart guy bought it cheap.
- Nobody will do any reward manipulation in dash network because some group of guys bought overpriced miners. Any attempt of reward manipulation will ruin whole network.

What are the ways out?
- Easy way. Reek you butthurt on forums and cry that dash is scam.
- Hard way. Swallow your disappointment, try to learn from your mistake, mine and hold. Because of expensive mining new coins supply will be limited for the exchanges (because more miners decide to hold) and price should go higher.
 
Ftoole said:
Oh I forgot butterfly labs the ran off with a lot of btc and never delivered. U should look at btc,s difficultly back in 2013 when comparing it to dash that’s when the ASICS hit.
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I'll see if I can make any correlations between those. Thanks!

But I will stick to my current argument that the algorithm currently set up is, comparably, four times less profit than btc would've made back then. That's of course, extrapolating the data that I've garnered today. I can see what youre saying though.
Twilight Miner said:
- It is not possible to compare different algos and its hashrate. Such comparison means nothing.
- Unprofitable mining does not mean that coin have any problems with scalability. Dash network will generate new block in 2.5 minutes and no matter how many miners will join or leave the network. Just difficulty will be reajusted.
- You cannot blame in this situation anyone but yourself. You was too greedy and did not do math before you buy miners.
- Same situation happened in bitcoin network several times. For example when first asics emerged but some guys already invested in GPU farms. In that time there were no much profitable altcoins and they thought they just lost money. Many of them sold their equipment but many other smart guy bought it cheap.
- Nobody will do any reward manipulation in dash network because some group of guys bought overpriced miners. Any attempt of reward manipulation will ruin whole network.

What are the ways out?
- Easy way. Reek you butthurt on forums and cry that dash is scam.
- Hard way. Swallow your disappointment, try to learn from your mistake, mine and hold. Because of expensive mining new coins supply will be limited for the exchanges (because more miners decide to hold) and price should go higher.
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Clearly you have no idea what you're talking about - if you've ever taken a statistics class, it is possible to create a coefficient for difficulty and hashrate without depending on specific algorithms. Using that coefficient, one can determine the comparable mining profitability independent of cryptocurrency price (profitability based off of the amount of hashrate one introduces to the network). The math is done - bitcoin will win the hash rate war in the end of the day. No one will support a network that promises more centralized power due to its poor ROI on the miners that actually spend the money on the equipment which holds up YOUR network.

And you guys think I'm still complaining about immediate profits. LOL - so ignorant, truly. Even in September 2013, the people were making negative returns but still mining hundreds of bitcoins. DASH is mining 2-30 a year, max, with a few months worth of ASICs. You're a fool if you think any miner is going to decide to support this network when they could easily transition to the one that makes x4 the profit. You really don't get it, do you? If you want to compete vs Bitcoin, DASH would have to be worth, today, 32,000 dollars each. Good luck with that without the hashrate.

My concerns have to do with the scalability and necessity of DASH's network infrastructure which none of you are investing in except for the masternode owners who aren't even contributing to the PoW that is necessary to process the transactions (who do you think is processing your fancy 2MB blocks? LOL) But please keep living in your ideology cloud and let me know when you all want to be adults and come up with some concrete scalability solutions instead of crying about people criticizing your shit algorithm.

Again - DASH, great idea, waste of a technology on this community. Blindly following devs. Then you wonder why returns on DASH are so poor in comparison.
 
Poor return on investment? I think u need to do some lookin November 2015 dash 2 bucks now 450. Growth of like 22500%.
Btc was about 350 now 7800 ish. Growth of like 2500%.
Would u rather had bought 1 btc or 150 dash in November of 2015?
I’d take the 150 dash.
 
Ftoole said:
Poor return on investment? I think u need to do some lookin November 2015 dash 2 bucks now 450. Growth of like 22500%.
Btc was about 350 now 7800 ish. Growth of like 2500%.
Would u rather had bought 1 btc or 150 dash in November of 2015?
I’d take the 150 dash.
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The ROI I represent is the one that all miners will have to face as the hashrate goes up along with the difficulty. As stated and calculated before, DASH difficulty rises at a rate 4 times faster than bitcoin for every arbitrary hashrate added to the system. In other words, if price was equal for DASH and Bitcoin and so were their short term profits, DASH would require 4 times less network hashrate. Less hashrate means less decentralization. Less decentralization means more centralization of power. More centralization means less miners. Less miners (and less hashrate) means you can upgrade the system all you want, but you will never scale to replace everyday transactions (which is why investors are sitting on bitcoins and DASH is simply siphoning off of its success).

So yes, for those who buy the cryptocurrency, good job, they win a lot of money. For those who invested into the infrastructure required for the network to really take off? They can go fuck themselves apparently, because only people who got in early on DASH are winning, not people who invest in trying to make it a truly decentralized system.
 
Yes dash’s difficulty is calculated by the time it took to create the last 24 blocks so future blocks will be spaced 2.5 mins apart. Which we could lower the difficulty but then thier would be more blocks created everyday and increase the coin supply which could cause downward pressure on the price. Is that what you think we should do? Or are you saying we should only re adjust the difficulty every 2 weeks like bitcoin?
 
Well, Bitmain cheated you and sold overpriced miners. Actually i dont think its cheating. Because they had clear offer and you agreed. And now instead of blaming yourself you try to blame dash community.
 
Twilight Miner said:
Well, Bitmain cheated you and sold overpriced miners. Actually i dont think its cheating. Because they had clear offer and you agreed. And now instead of blaming yourself you try to blame dash community.
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You have 0 idea what is going on in this thread. Please leave. I haven't even mentioned the price of Bitmain's D3.
 
Ftoole said:
Yes dash’s difficulty is calculated by the time it took to create the last 24 blocks so future blocks will be spaced 2.5 mins apart. Which we could lower the difficulty but then thier would be more blocks created everyday and increase the coin supply which could cause downward pressure on the price. Is that what you think we should do? Or are you saying we should only re adjust the difficulty every 2 weeks like bitcoin?
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I might've missed that part in my calculations - the change in difficulty is determined on block generations. I don't think lowering the difficulty is necessary, but I think the rate of which it changes needs to be slowed down. This would obviously have the effect of lowering difficulty, but it really needs to be adjusted in order to get more incentive for people to add to the network hashrate
 
Just imagine situation if dash devs will decide to help you and increase reward. Of course it will lead to price decay.
But for example that there is another guy who decided to invest in MN. Now its nearly 450k usd. And why HE should lose money because of YOUR mistake?

Also dash network will be operating even it will have just ONE miner. Difficaulty will drop but this miner will earn only 1.8 dash every 2.5 min. No more.

I think you need to investigate how crypto currencies works before screaming out.
 
Lowering difficulty with constant quantity of miners will lead to more coins generated. More coins supply will lead to price decay. Period.

And again lower difficulty will help only BITMAIN to run more miners. And you helped them with your orders to gain more hashpower in their hands.
 
Checkerama said:
I might've missed that part in my calculations - the change in difficulty is determined on block generations. I don't think lowering the difficulty is necessary, but I think the rate of which it changes needs to be slowed down. This would obviously have the effect of lowering difficulty, but it really needs to be adjusted in order to get more incentive for people to add to the network hashrate
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With DGW adjust every block on a moving average and dash has used v3 since 2014. Changing rules mid stream seems off.
 
Twilight Miner said:
Lowering difficulty with constant quantity of miners will lead to more coins generated. More coins supply will lead to price decay. Period.

And again lower difficulty will help only BITMAIN to run more miners. And you helped them with your orders to gain more hashpower in their hands.
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Oh my God you are so off on the whole purpose of this thread why are you still talking like you know what you're talking about???

DASH will still run on ONE miner? LOL, how dumb can you get, honestly? Do you know what happens when transactions surpass network hashrate capability? A fuckton of orphaned blocks. But you know... keep dreaming that hashrates aren't important.
 
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