Renaming PrivateSend Discussion - In response to the 2020 Q4 Conference Call

-crypto

New Member
Masternode Owner/Operator
Jun 17, 2017
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Mixing is now available thru Electrum Dash and should be available on Dashpay thru them, I don't think PS is just for power users,
all users that don't like being snooped on will want it available.

I don't need websites seeing what I am buying so Google can serve up more ads.
I agree. I'm suggesting that we make it even easier by doing it with a "personal account" in the wallet that automatically mixes the coins. The coins in the "personal account" could also act like a savings account and earn interest for their inclusion in the "coinjoin" pool.

I would like to lose branding that includes "Private" because it's a red flag for regulators. I would also like to make Dash earnings more accessible to everyone and I think that the act of providing coins to be mixed has a value that should be compensated.
 

Geert

Member
Aug 26, 2015
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Coin mixing is a service of the network, and like all services there needs to be a cost associated with it. We can't pay people to mix. If the cost of mixing is zero or negative we open the door to DOS/spam attacks.
 
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GrandMasterDash

Grizzled Member
Masternode Owner/Operator
Jul 12, 2015
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Btw, I think the coin mixing should be reworked as a wallet plugin i.e. let the end user decide if they want it or not. It would also allow for the plugin to be maintained by someone else other than DCG.

Use WebAssembly for wallet plugins, this might encourage cross chain development with projects like beam.
 
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Jmmon

New Member
Mar 9, 2017
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I liked the suggestion on Reddit of making a personal account within the wallet. The act of moving coins to that account would mix them. Sending from the personal account would essentially be a "private send" without raising red flags. Not my idea, just a suggestion that I read and thought was good.

My hope is that we can incentivize the act of mixing to provide an alternative path to earning rewards in the form of interest on the unspent coins being mixed. The interest could be derived from a % of the MN and Mining rewards, or from unallocated proposal Dash instead of burning it.
Both of these ideas I like. One of the visions of DashPay was to have a Cash account (automatic mixing) and a Savings account (regular unmixed dash).

I also like the idea of paying rewards to those who mix. Right now there is a time cost and a slight random fee for those who mix coins. It would be good to rebalance the incentives and offset the time cost with some rewards, and get more people mixing. I've thought about how to test-run how rewards might affect how many people mix their coins. I was thinking a small reward every block which would go to a random address that participated in mixing in that block. If no mixing happens in the block the reward is never created, or something. This would spread the incentive across all hours of the day to help even out mixing liquidity. The reward could be pre-denominated in the denomination which earned the reward, so the reward would also go into the mixing queue. Not sure how that would work exactly but that was my first thoughts. It might even only cost a few % of the block reward for these mixing incentives.

But not sure how a wallet would handle a PS address which, after the reward, would have 2x a denomination instead of just 1x.
 
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salmion

New Member
May 16, 2014
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Public balance and Cash Balance
Make Cash

and just Send
In Send modal have an option to:
Use cash balance (more private)

We are digital cash, it’s the most innocuous and descriptive term.
1. Everyone knows what cash is and has used it.
2. Instead of comparing ourselves to BTC, let’s compare ourselves to Fiat. They can’t judge us for being like cash!
 
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Geert

Member
Aug 26, 2015
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Eventually IMHO PrivateSend will be something handled in the background, the same way that InstantSend is no longer something the end user needs to be concerned with.

Inventing less descriptive names for "PrivateSend" and "Mixing" is not the way to go IMHO.
 

Ryan Taylor

Well-known Member
Dash Core Team
Foundation Member
Jul 3, 2014
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Scottsdale, AZ, USA
Late to the discussion on this... we are honestly just leaning toward unbranding it altogether, at least until we can conduct a proper assessment of the best terminology that will not cause confusion to the average user... and wouldn't cause some of the issues that I've read about in this thread (like if we called it ProtectSend it implies normal transactions are at risk). By unbranding we just call it "CoinJoin" and can provide an info link for users unfamiliar with the term.

This provides us with time to properly assess the best possible brand ... or whether a brand is even required. As pointed out, full node QT wallets are primarily for power users, so the branding shouldn't matter that much until we add CoinJoin to DashPay wallets. DashPay itself is an enhancement of our existing wallets, and the addition of CoinJoin (and associated feature branding) would be most useful when CoinJoin is added to the mainstream-consumer oriented DashPay wallet.
 

DAshBlo9ws

New Member
May 24, 2021
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so what is it called and where is the documentation on how to freakin use privatesend or protectsend or just "dashsend" whatever the heck you wanna call it. Very poor management and leadership here.
 

AgnewPickens

Moderator
Moderator
Mar 11, 2017
390
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so what is it called and where is the documentation on how to freakin use privatesend or protectsend or just "dashsend" whatever the heck you wanna call it. Very poor management and leadership here.

CoinJoin is the name now. I know, a lot of the community is not overly thrilled with the change.
 

thephez

Member
Dash Core Team
Jan 23, 2016
120
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so what is it called and where is the documentation on how to freakin use privatesend or protectsend or just "dashsend" whatever the heck you wanna call it. Very poor management and leadership here.
Same place it's been since Dash Core 0.12.3 - https://docs.dash.org/en/stable/wallets/dashcore/privatesend-instantsend.html (which now redirects to https://docs.dash.org/en/stable/wallets/dashcore/coinjoin-instantsend.html). Also linked to directly from "Help -> CoinJoin Information" in the Dash Core Qt wallet.