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Proposal: Tao Community Coordinator

Discussion in 'Pre + Budget Proposal Discussions' started by TaoOfSatoshi, Jun 17, 2016.

  1. alex-ru

    alex-ru Grizzled Member
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    I would add: more people -> more investments -> bigger price of DASH -> bigger monthly budget (for development of Evolution also)
     
  2. AndyDark

    AndyDark Well-known Member

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    Thanks for the kind words :) You don't need to thank me though or justify yourself, you are the biggest promoter of Dash and I think everyone appreciates that :)

    Not sure about this one though. My spider senses are telling me there is more work like meetings, chats, emails or postings hidden in there somewhere. I mean we already have several weekly meetings and reporting to do and several official liasons etc etc. If this goes through, what kind of time will you be using of other devs or non-devs (because their time is largely to help devs)?
     
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  3. bertlebbert

    bertlebbert Active Member

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    Here is one possible answer:

    DashNation hopefully attracts additional interest in Dash >
    Additional interest hopefully motivates more investment in Dash >
    More investment probably creates higher market price of Dash >
    Higher market price does results in larger monthly budget >
    Larger budget hopefully provides greater Evo funding >
    Greater Evo funding > ...well, you get the idea ?
     
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  4. AndyDark

    AndyDark Well-known Member

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    yes i'm totally down with Tao's promotion side, and the more budget for development better

    it's the project time i'm worried about e.g.

    "Enhance communication between the core team and community."

    well that needs people time. and we already have liaisons inside the core team. why make a role just outside the core team for communication, why not just join the core team, otherwise Tao will liaise with core team liaisons, who will be tapping up devs for more information. seems convoluted to me.
     
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  5. bertlebbert

    bertlebbert Active Member

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    Ah, I understand... what you are asking is:
    why make a role just outside the core team for communication?
    why not just join the core team?

    Those are good questions.
     
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  6. AndyDark

    AndyDark Well-known Member

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    yes, most people would be quite shocked to how many various "core team" meetings are going on (actually different groups with some cross over meeting face to face different days each week on webex with a ton of reporting, spreadsheets, documents, finances, kind of like high level board meetings) and if a liaison isn't plugged into that it will double up everyone's work having to find out stuff and relay that etc etc (and we already have people publishing this info anyway)

    I think Tao's time is quite valuable to everyone with what he's already doing too, generating Dash news / content on social media, creating public awareness, bringing in new users, this would take his time away from that which i don't think is needed either and what Tao's already doing is adding a lot of value in the area we really need.
     
    #36 AndyDark, Jun 20, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 20, 2016
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  7. TaoOfSatoshi

    TaoOfSatoshi Grizzled Member
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    This is exactly it. A larger community leads to increased demand, and a stronger network effect which giving people something to represent and feel passionate about only makes stronger. I already see it in the Russian division of Dash Nation! :D

    Thank you for your kind words. Most of the questions I see would not take a lot of time to answer, and I would strive to answer them within 24-48 hours. A quick PM would more than suffice in most cases.

    That's the plan! It's worked so far. Dash Nation is going to be a big user of Dash, obviously, and will spread the word about Dash in all the ways it can, online and in person.

    Yes, I can see that, but the community co-ordination is only one aspect of my role. Honestly, I feel that my time invested promoting should be worth something, considering my results and investment I've brought in. So, I took on another role I saw a need for, and made it a package deal. Bill 101 if you will...:)

    My position as a non-official liaison would make me better suited to communicate with both sides. I'd like to think I have both side's trust by now, and I would use my skills to good effect to keep everyone informed, and to bring legitimate community concerns to the core team.

    Thanks for all of your comments!
     
  8. AndyDark

    AndyDark Well-known Member

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    "both sides"......"bring legitimate community concerns to the core team"...this is really political Tao. We need to be looking outside of Dash and building our market and ignoring the concern-trolls, not setting up an official spokesperson to build a bridge between them and the people building the software. I know you're trying to help but this might not go the way you're thinking and i'm sure there is more overhead for development here somewhere :)
     
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  9. TaoOfSatoshi

    TaoOfSatoshi Grizzled Member
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    Sure. I'm aware that my time would be better spent with promotion, which would be the major portion of how my time would be spent. I just see the need for better communication in Dash. So, if you support me, you're getting a highly motivated spokesperson, and someone who is actively looking at the social channels to see if there are any questions or legitimate concerns that need to be addressed. I made it a trial for that very reason you stated, if I don't do exactly as I proposed, I would expect to not be renewed. But I ask for the Masternodes to let me walk my talk, if you know what I mean. ;)
     
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  10. TroyDASH

    TroyDASH Well-known Member
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    @AndyDark, having Tao act as an agreeable liaison will reduce the amount of time that developers will be spending on "concern trolls". I think many of us can be convinced to allow Tao to help vet feedback to make sure it is appropriate and constructive. If dealing with so many people one on one is not a good use of your time, then having Tao take on this role is an opportunity for you to not feel the need to respond to just anything that gets thrown at you. I know it can be exhausting trying to actually understand the substance of what another person is really trying to communicate at the same time as disregarding any snarky jabs. I would trust Tao to keep a lookout for when something like this is happening and to help get things straight to the real point.
     
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  11. AndyDark

    AndyDark Well-known Member

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    I already have to spend a significant amount of time working with existing liaisons, for reporting, project management, strategy, progress reporting, updates, meetings etc.

    Adding another liaison is not going to reduce my workload, it will increase it. Plus if that liaison's job is to condense "concerns" from forum members, that is really not speeding up Evolution development.

    It is the Network that is governing Dash, and Evolution has a mandate to do the work as per the Network approved proposals / specs.

    That governance is protected by cost - small minorities cannot change specs / structure / work / actions, only the people with the real interest in Dash can collectively.

    Concern on forums is really not a major concern of mine that I will be putting time into, either on the forum or talking to anyone appointed to bringing those concerns to my attention.

    Those concerns should be brought directly to the network and dealt with in a democratic way, what's happening here is potentially an attack vector where a small troll group like we had on BCT could essentially flood the forums at low cost and actually start to effect relay change / disrupt development without needing the masternodes to do so.

    This is a green card to have an open channel that allows bypassing the network governance potentially in my opinion, which is why I am warning Tao of how this might go, because obviously Tao is one of our best contributors in the community and I want to protect his time / value and mine too.

    Tao, please focus on your social media work which is adding a lot of value. I for one don't want me or my team having more meetings / liaising especially with the kind of parties you are proposing we liaise with.
     
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  12. TroyDASH

    TroyDASH Well-known Member
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    I would point out that if a "concern" were to be taken to the MNs to be decided in a democratic way, this can and already has been interpreted by core developers as unnecessary and antagonistic when most matters can be resolved without MNs. In Amanda's thread Evan has already suggested a procedure for handling things like this, and MN vote is intended to be only used if the other avenues fail.

    Part of the reason we need someone in this role is because, frankly, the developers who interact here on the forum are closely attached to their work and thus when they receive criticism they are often not adept at identifying who is trolling and who actually has a significant interest in DASH.

    This will in no way impose any reporting requirements on you. The only person who might want to create reports is Tao himself, for example if he wanted to present to @kot or to all of us, a summary of his progress and the health of the Dash community.
     
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  13. TaoOfSatoshi

    TaoOfSatoshi Grizzled Member
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    Crossposted here for relevancy:

    Dash Nation's goals are EXACTLY the same as Dash's. It doesn't have its own agenda as it exists because of Dash. It is simply a gathering of like-minded people who are attracted to that sense of belonging, and passion for something. We are a global community of Dash fans, doing what we can to promote it, and based on what you wrote here, I'd love to have you on the team. Enhancing Dash's message will always be the goal of Dash Nation.

    Some do, but honestly, outside of these forums, the ideas I have brought forth are getting great feedback. Also, not everyone here disagrees either. When I first ran the poll asking "Would you like to be a part of Dash Nation?", the overwhelming majority said YES.

    This is exactly the goal of Dash Nation, I just chose to give it a less boring name. The goals align however, and if you would like to bury the hatchet, realize that Dash Nation will be a thing, we'd love to have you on board, helping us out.

    This is the crux of the problem as I see it. You view Dash Nation as its own unique entity, and that people that join are fans of Dash Nation, not Dash. This is incorrect. People who join Red Sox Nation are the biggest passionate fans of the Boston Red Sox, buying season tickets, buying merchandise, following them on the road, and contributing to the team's bottom line, while encouraging others to do so as well. Can you see the correlation, and what I'm trying to accomplish with Dash Nation? Only this baby is global, and will be Red Sox Nation x1,000,000! Dash is the reason for Dash Nation, make no mistake.

    These are great suggestions. "Proud members of Dash Nation" would make for great stickers and promotional materials, eye-catching and great conversation starters. Please help us.

    I completely agree.

    That is one of the mandates of www.dashnation.com. We actively seek out Dash news and put it in one easy to follow place, coincidentally with its own newsletter, which you think is a good idea.

    Thank you. You have given me some great ideas, and like @TheDashGuy said, it would be great if you could give us pointers. Good luck with Dash World as well!
     
  14. TaoOfSatoshi

    TaoOfSatoshi Grizzled Member
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    Not all concerns are legit. I have been here enough and have the sense to know which ones need to be addressed and which ones are there to stir up trouble. You can count on me to be an effective filter. You are busy, and I wouldn't dream of hindering your progress (or mine for that matter). :)
     
  15. TaoOfSatoshi

    TaoOfSatoshi Grizzled Member
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    ANNOUNCEMENT: I have responded to community feedback by modifying the name of this proposal to "Tao: Community Coordinator". The Community Coordinator position has the sub jobs of Community Builder, and Community Communicator.

    https://www.dashwhale.org/p/tao-community-lead

    I don't know if the blockchain name can be modified, maybe an expert can chime in with that.

    I feel that this more accurately conveys the intentions behind the proposal, and hope that it addresses concerns people have about it. As always, I am around to address any questions and concerns. Thanks to those who have supported me thus far, and I hope to gain the trust of those who haven't.

    Sincerely,

    Tao.
     
    #45 TaoOfSatoshi, Jun 22, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2016
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  16. bandidorl

    bandidorl Active Member
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    I´m very sorry but since the last neverending polemic with core slack channel and thedashguy I will change my votes to no. I think it´s not appropiate to try to be a leader by disruption and propaganda.
     
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  17. TaoOfSatoshi

    TaoOfSatoshi Grizzled Member
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    I'm sorry you feel that way. While I am not responsible for a lot of what's going on, I respect your opinion. Maybe over time, I can win your vote back. I'm currently concentrating on what's made me so successful, which is community building and helping others around the Dashsphere. Watch me for the next couple of weeks, you'll see what I'm about. Don't give up on me, yet! :)

    Cheers,

    Tao.
     
  18. bandidorl

    bandidorl Active Member
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    I want to thank you for all our past efforts and I greatly encourage you to continue doing the right things you are doing because you are an invaluable asset to Dash but I think perhaps that´s not the right moment nor the right way to do it.
     
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  19. TaoOfSatoshi

    TaoOfSatoshi Grizzled Member
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    Thank you for your kind words. I will do just that.
     
  20. camosoul

    camosoul Grizzled Member

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    I've got nothing against Tao. I also don't care about the drama. I just don't see the good in creating an unneeded office and appointing one's self to it. No matter who it is. I hate bureaucracy.

    This is essentially a vote to create an office for someone who has already appointed himself to it. I don't care who you are, what you've done, what your name is; that's a bad idea. I dislike the precedent and concept that this creates, not the person.
     
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  21. TaoOfSatoshi

    TaoOfSatoshi Grizzled Member
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    I can see your point. If this proposal does not pass, I will look into making another one that deals with compensating me for my time and results, without making it so political.

    I just want to contribute to Dash and grow a community of engaged and passionate people, as I have been doing, and be valued by the network for my hard work. If this turns out not to be the way to do it, I will try again. I've never been a quitter!

    Thank you for your comments, Camo.
     
  22. Alexy

    Alexy Well-known Member
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    Dear Tao~ Like you said, you have already helped lots of people. To me, with or without any title, you can still doing the same thing here. So keep rolling~To be what we should be, to do what we should do. I was inspired by all of the volunteers(like you) in the Community. Doing the best i can to make the project better. This time i did vote No this time, simply because i know you can do so much better next time. Yep~ if this turns out not to be the way to do it. Think carefully, gather all the suggestions, try next time~ You are approved by many members who you once helped, they voted yes for thank you because of the MN setup guide you wrote. keep doing in that way~ the main goal of proposal is Help the Community members, right?;) Wish you the best~ Always
     
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  23. camosoul

    camosoul Grizzled Member

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    Do you know what DASH does need?

    Vendor Outreach.

    Vendors are the key users who's user experience is being neglected. Their incredibly bad user experience is being completely ignored. As is typical of the cryptotard community.

    All coins other than DASH have no reason to bother, because they are vendor-hostile by design.

    DASH has the feature set that they lack, and can be vendor-friendly. But, InstantSend is being left to rot on the vine due to the pervasive neo-soviet crypto-ponzi mindset. While the features are uniquely vendor-friendly, the community and development staff are either vendor-oblivious or vendor-hostile.

    This is an office which is screamingly, bleedingly, desperately needed!

    Be that guy! I can't imagine how a person could vote no on that... But I'm sure there's enough retarded MNOs that it'll happen...

    https://www.dashwhale.org/p/bsdev-general-fund

    Go help this. We need outreach to our own MNOs. They need to be educated. We don't have much need to tell the world when the world still can't do a damn thing with DASH. Preaching to ponzi-head cryptotards doesn't help DASH, either. DASH's own MNOs are utterly clueless! Clean up your own shop before you go looking for converts...

    https://www.dashwhale.org/p/flagship-merchant1

    See if you can line up some REAL merchants to work on. I did this once and the community shit all over it... How 'bout you give it a try? You like o stroke peoples' egos and make them feel good. They don't have irrational, animalistic reactions to you and vote off their nose to spite their face. Go for it!

    This should be DASH's ultimate top priority, but it's being treated like an afterthought, if even that, because most of the community and core developers are out of touch with reality. Yeah, I know, the mechanics are much more annoying compared to how Evolution will do it. If you wait that long, someone else is going to snatch up the market and you'll never get it back. If you fail to move just because the situation is less than ideal, you'll never get anything done.

    PS and IS can be implemented, less ideally, in a peer to peer fashion. Being slightly better after something like that grabs the market; you'll never get it back. Why? Vendors. See the Vendors' perspective. Credit/Debit Cards have fees, and Chargebacks can come as much as 180 days later! If a less-than-ideal peer-to-peer coin reduces that to 15 seconds by cloning InstantSend (what a terrible name, BTW, has nothing to do with what it does...)... DASH doing it is 2 seconds really won't matter anymore. All 3 are instant in the consumer's eyes... They don't give a shit which one they end up with. It's the vendors who make a difference, and DASH isn't even in the race for the very feature that it invented! Are you fucking kidding me? Do you really think that Vendors or End Consumers give one flying fuck about your horribly busted self-governance? Explain auditable-privacy-in-plain-view to any of the people standing in line at the Wal Mart check out. I dare you to find even one person who can comprehend it and find a way to give a damn. Even the ponzi-heads who do understand it still don't care...

    DASH is losing it's own race... It hasn't even shown up a full year after it invented the race! It doesn't matter if Evolution will do this much more cleanly if someone else has grabbed the market by then. It doesn't matter what Evolution will be. The race is on NOW. Get in the game or just kill yourself already...
     
    #53 camosoul, Jun 25, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2016
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