Proposal: Dash Point-of-Sale System (InstantSend enabled)

kodaxx

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Nov 26, 2016
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Dash Point-of-Sale



What is DashPay POS?


DashPay POS is a free mobile point-of-sale app designed to run on mobile platforms (Android, iOS, Windows Phone), desktop platforms (Linux, macOS, Windows), and standalone hardware terminals. This project is designed for merchants to be able to accept Dash quickly, easily, and securely. In order to further adoption of Dash we need to make it easy for merchants to accept Dash as a form of payment. This system will enable them to do so.

Budget Breakdown

50 Dash - Nitya (server) - development efforts, testing, hosting fees
50 Dash - kodaxx (client) - development efforts, testing, graphics
60 Dash - Hardware terminals, ledgers/keepkey/trezor (compatibility testing)
5 Dash - Reimbursement for this proposal
-------------------------
Total: 165 Dash

More Project Info:

This project has been up for vote for most of the month - voting ends on feb 3rd, 2017

pre-proposal and discussion: click here
official project proposal pdf: click here
dashcentral page: click here
alpha source code: click here
demo video: click here

---------------------------------------------------------------

Some FAQ:

-What is the objective?

This project addresses a basic need of Dash - adoption. This project will be a tool to help merchants accept dash easily once they’ve decided to participate in the Dash ecosystem. Not only will this help those who have decided this, but it may sway others who would like to, but think it is too difficult.

The objective of this project is to reduce the complexity for merchants willing to accept Dash as payment, and to create a great experience for customers wanting to purchase with Dash.

-Why use this instead of a mobile wallet?
One of the main reasons a merchant would use this app over the standard mobile wallet would be to have an experience they are familiar with. It has been designed to be very closely related to credit card processing machines in this respect.

The main reason however, besides ease of use and familiarity, is the fact that this terminal is not a wallet. In fact, it only generates the address and payment requests to a wallet that the merchant controls on a different machine. This means that there is no control of the coins from the POS software. This situation works especially well when you have employees that may access this machine as well.

Plus, keeping your private keys offline is always a bonus!

-What are the features planned for this release?
  • Works on Android, iOS, Windows Phone - Mac, Windows, Linux
  • Compatible with Trezor/KeepKey/Ledger Hardware Wallets
  • Generate a new account on first run. Customize store name, create backups, etc.
  • Enter sale amounts in your local currency (only supports USD at the moment) and have them converted to an amount in Dash using http://coinmarketcap.com exchange rate
  • A QR code payment request is generated with your receiving address, sale amount, store name, and 'use InstantSend' for your customers to scan
  • Unique addresses are used for every sale that are a part of your HD wallet. One private key
  • Get an on-screen notification when the requested amount is received at your address
  • Detects partial payments and allows multiple parties to pay the total amount owed
-Are there features planned beyond this release?
  • NFC touch-to-pay with mobile phones using Dash Wallet
  • Multiple currency support (USD, CAD, UAD, etc.)
  • Offline payments system using plastic EMV-type cards for customers
  • Ability to have payments converted to fiat instantly

License info
This software (client, server, everything) will be released under a free open source license (MIT license). If this project is funded we do not intend to code in any percentage charge to the merchant or any other cost mechanism.
 

camosoul

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Sep 19, 2014
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You've gotta be the dumbest person to ever live to vote against this... This is the ultimate duh that DASH should have been doing for the last 2 years. DASH is nothing but another ponzi game without this.
 
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Solarminer

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Apr 4, 2015
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Dash is not moving forward until proposals like this pass. Vote yes on this. If you were wondering why the 100 days didn't meet its goal, this was one part needed. Who will use a crypto if they have to use the core wallet that takes 10 minutes to load? See how this says IOS...yeah, that part is important.
 

camosoul

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@Solarminer is probably not going to like me for this, but...

I'm going to publicize something here I hadn't mentioned publicly before, which could help anyone who wants to set up the service that connects to this. A little backstory...

DASH is the only crypto I know of that actually secures TXes at the time they are sent, without falling back to making the blockchain run double duty. The fact that DASH cannot be InstanTXed without first being seasoned in the blockchain, is a feature, not a bug.

In a similar way to the fact that you can't just walk into a Real Estate Agent's office and throw down cash to buy a house. It has to be on paper somewhere first. Keep this in mind.

Forcing everyone to us DASH and give up their precious shitcoin might be a bit tough at first. So, don't.

Build a shapeshift.io layer into the service. Advise them that they will have to wait for their shitcoin's confirmations.

The TX coming in from shapeshift.io won't be InstanTX. But, it doesn't matter.

Why?

Because if someone working at shapeshift.io gets the wise idea to run a double-spend, their name is on it. It's another form of "seasoned."

If the buyer double-spends on shapeshift.io, that's their problem, not yours.

If you force the cryptotards to trade for DASH themselves, they find out that you can't InstanTX without waiting first, and they get confused because they've never heard of the concept of "seasoned" money. The FUD begins.

There's going to be waiting either way. Why not let shapeshift.io cover it for you and put the onus on the shitcoin? It solves several problems at once.

They get to spend their precious shitcoin.
You don't have to worry about explaining "seasoned" money to basement dwelling doofuses who have never had enough money to find out what that is.
The vendor doesn't get dragged into a coin supremacy battle of wits with a retard. they can turn the feature on or off at will.
Shapeshift.io is on the hook for potential double-spends, not you.
The Vendor and the Spender both know who's really on the hook for this "waiting for confirmations" bullshit.

You get showcased exactly as you want to be, and all the bad shit is put exactly where it belongs. It turns the very process of using DASH into an indisputable argument in favor of itself. Anyone who does it will never be able to present an argument. Every single cryptotard that uses it will become a convert and sing the praises, or look like an absolute idiot.

Now, has anyone on these forums ever presented such a graceful way of making lemonade out of all those lemons?

You could even daisy-chain this into an existing service, like BitPay. Could do it right now without BitPay even knowing it... Give yourself 5%. Hell, there's that much spread between the exchanges.

2 years I had that one. And, did anyone else come up with it? Did anyone even try? Nope, I'm just a troll...

I've already looked into this. Even as far as becoming a Money Transmitter and providing the service myself. Frankly, I don't wanna. I have shit I want to do with my life, not keep playing the "biggest turd in the bowl" game with a bunch of poo-flinging dirt monkeys.

I'm not a turd. I'm definitely not the biggest turd. I'm not getting in the bowl (again). I've done my time in the bowl with the turds. Now it's your turn.

So there it is. Enjoy.

It would have to be built into the "terminal," or the terminal so flexible that it could display the QR regardless... Let the server figure it all out.

Too bad I'm on their ignore lists for being "troll." I guess only the smart non-snowflake people will see this...
 
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Solarminer

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Apr 4, 2015
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@Solarminer is probably not going to like me for this, but...
Well, Camo just gave the instructions and details from the merchant adoption proposal we talked about last year. Evolution is obviously way too important to put any real resources on this. (that was sarcastic) 165 Dash on this is just a drop in the bucket of all the scam projects that get passed.
 

stan.distortion

Active Member
Oct 30, 2014
848
497
133
@Solarminer is probably not going to like me for this, but...

I'm going to publicize something here I hadn't mentioned publicly before, which could help anyone who wants to set up the service that connects to this. A little backstory...

DASH is the only crypto I know of that actually secures TXes at the time they are sent, without falling back to making the blockchain run double duty. The fact that DASH cannot be InstanTXed without first being seasoned in the blockchain, is a feature, not a bug.

In a similar way to the fact that you can't just walk into a Real Estate Agent's office and throw down cash to buy a house. It has to be on paper somewhere first. Keep this in mind.

Forcing everyone to us DASH and give up their precious shitcoin might be a bit tough at first. So, don't.

Build a shapeshift.io layer into the service. Advise them that they will have to wait for their shitcoin's confirmations.

The TX coming in from shapeshift.io won't be InstanTX. But, it doesn't matter.

Why?

Because if someone working at shapeshift.io gets the wise idea to run a double-spend, their name is on it. It's another form of "seasoned."

If the buyer double-spends on shapeshift.io, that's their problem, not yours.

If you force the cryptotards to trade for DASH themselves, they find out that you can't InstanTX without waiting first, and they get confused because they've never heard of the concept of "seasoned" money. The FUD begins.

There's going to be waiting either way. Why not let shapeshift.io cover it for you and put the onus on the shitcoin? It solves several problems at once.

They get to spend their precious shitcoin.
You don't have to worry about explaining "seasoned" money to basement dwelling doofuses who have never had enough money to find out what that is.
The vendor doesn't get dragged into a coin supremacy battle of wits with a retard. they can turn the feature on or off at will.
Shapeshift.io is on the hook for potential double-spends, not you.
The Vendor and the Spender both know who's really on the hook for this "waiting for confirmations" bullshit.

You get showcased exactly as you want to be, and all the bad shit is put exactly where it belongs. It turns the very process of using DASH into an indisputable argument in favor of itself. Anyone who does it will never be able to present an argument. Every single cryptotard that uses it will become a convert and sing the praises, or look like an absolute idiot.

Now, has anyone on these forums ever presented such a graceful way of making lemonade out of all those lemons?

You could even daisy-chain this into an existing service, like BitPay. Could do it right now without BitPay even knowing it... Give yourself 5%. Hell, there's that much spread between the exchanges.

2 years I had that one. And, did anyone else come up with it? Did anyone even try? Nope, I'm just a troll...

I've already looked into this. Even as far as becoming a Money Transmitter and providing the service myself. Frankly, I don't wanna. I have shit I want to do with my life, not keep playing the "biggest turd in the bowl" game with a bunch of poo-flinging dirt monkeys.

I'm not a turd. I'm definitely not the biggest turd. I'm not getting in the bowl (again). I've done my time in the bowl with the turds. Now it's your turn.

So there it is. Enjoy.

It would have to be built into the "terminal," or the terminal so flexible that it could display the QR regardless... Let the server figure it all out.

Too bad I'm on their ignore lists for being "troll." I guess only the smart non-snowflake people will see this...
Damn, I bet the basement dwelling doofuses at Shapeshift never thought of the super obvious usefulness of that when they where planning out their super obviously useful service :p For you next trick, tell us how it's super obviously done as a decentralised service ;)
 

camosoul

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Sep 19, 2014
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Damn, I bet the basement dwelling doofuses at Shapeshift never thought of the super obvious usefulness of that when they where planning out their super obviously useful service :p For you next trick, tell us how it's super obviously done as a decentralised service ;)
I think you missed the point. Conflation trollpost is conflating...

This uses an aspect of Shapeshift that is not advertised, or even considered a part of their service. And that's only a minor detail... What about the rest of the post? Context?

I also never said anything about Shapeshift being dumb people... But most of their users are. So much so that they could read my post and completely miss the point of it. Then proceed to write a trollpost that only results in exposing their own ability to miss the point entirely.

You could be buying stuff at the Gas Station and Wal Mart with DASH right now. But you pissed on it by acting like this... ETH and BTC could already be memories like MtGox... We could already be past the point of "man, how did we ever think that was a good idea?" when reminiscing about good ol DOGE and LTC...

"Not ready yet"

Whatever, man...

This echo chamber just plain doesn't get it... Even if you explain it all to them, they still can't see it any way but their own...

VENDORS DON'T WANT TO DEAL WITH CRYPTOTARD DRAMA.
 
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stan.distortion

Active Member
Oct 30, 2014
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I think you missed the point. Conflation trollpost is conflating...

This uses an aspect of Shapeshift that is not advertised, or even considered a part of their service.

I also never said anything about Shapeshift being dumb people... But most of their users are. So much so that they could read my post and completely miss the point of it. Then proceed to write a trollpost that only resulting in exposing their own ability to miss the point entirely.

You could be buying stuff at the gas station and Wal Mart with DASH right now. But you pissed on it by acting like this...
Your failure to understand my reasoning behind the post doesn't make it trolling, there's more to "gateways" than fiat and "gateways" doesn't inherently mean centralised services. You don't address the usual "why it take so long??" issues with it either, just pass the buck on it and that's a fairly simple issue to resolve, it just needs to be termed differently. Or maybe I'm simply not in the 0.000001% of the population as smart as you, right? ;)
 

camosoul

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It says one month remaining at dashcentral... Are you sure it's in before the scheduled budgetpocalypse?
 

camosoul

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Well, Camo just gave the instructions and details from the merchant adoption proposal we talked about last year. Evolution is obviously way too important to put any real resources on this. (that was sarcastic) 165 Dash on this is just a drop in the bucket of all the scam projects that get passed.
They could ahve funded us and had this done a year ago... Eh, spilt milk. Moving on. I'd like to see @kodaxx make at least this part happen. It would make it stupid easy for BitPay or Coinbase to step in for the back end...
 
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camosoul

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The only concern I came up with regarding the old-phone-as-terminal was the possibility of disgruntled employees presenting their own phone as the payment target and not the official terminal.

The only problem I see is that the vendors might consider that you're "forcing" them to buy a Trezor or the like. They won't want to learn enough to safely do without it... Rolling this into a service that does everything server-side seems to be a missing construct.
 
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David

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Dash Support Group
Jun 21, 2014
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Your failure to understand my reasoning behind the post doesn't make it trolling, there's more to "gateways" than fiat and "gateways" doesn't inherently mean centralised services. You don't address the usual "why it take so long??" issues with it either, just pass the buck on it and that's a fairly simple issue to resolve, it just needs to be termed differently. Or maybe I'm simply not in the 0.000001% of the population as smart as you, right? ;)
You mean that after all this time, there are still people who don't have camo on ignore?
 
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kodaxx

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It says one month remaining at dashcentral... Are you sure it's in before the scheduled budgetpocalypse?
Just received payment today!

They could ahve funded us and had this done a year ago... Eh, spilt milk. Moving on. I'd like to see @kodaxx make at least this part happen. It would make it stupid easy for BitPay or Coinbase to step in for the back end...
And that may be talked about as well....lots of options here! For now, I will deliver on this proposal and consider the next steps carefully before making another.

The only concern I came up with regarding the old-phone-as-terminal was the possibility of disgruntled employees presenting their own phone as the payment target and not the official terminal.

The only problem I see is that the vendors might consider that you're "forcing" them to buy a Trezor or the like. They won't want to learn enough to safely do without it... Rolling this into a service that does everything server-side seems to be a missing construct.
I agree with this ^ and that is partially the reason we will have available the official hardware terminals if a business deems this necessary. If they have issues with that, or anticipate issues then we can get them set up.

Honestly, the same can be said for Square now. What would stop me from handing you my phone with a square reader instead of the owners phone?

I guess fraud charges because Square knows who you are...yeah..maybe that lol
 

camosoul

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...the same can be said for Square now. What would stop me from handing you my phone with a square reader instead of the owners phone?

I guess fraud charges because Square knows who you are...yeah..maybe that lol
It's not Fraud, actually... It's more akin to employee theft. They took the money from the customer, and instead of putting it in the cash register, they put it in their own pocket. Demonstrate that their business functions don't re-arrange around this. Show them that DASH is conforming to their needs instead of placing absurd demands on them and leaving holes everywhere.

It's certainly not a unique concern, but having a procedure for it outlined is what Vendors will like to see. Since this is a two-ended project, it would become easy for one to blame the other... Or even blame the Vendor saying "It's not us who did it, don't you have procedures for Employee theft?" Certainly, that's exactly what it is, but guidance in that direction would be good. A new concept like this, and people blank their brains acting like they have no clue what to do. They get with the program so much easier when you show them that you're catering to them, and nothing really changes. This goes a step in the direction of demonstrating "It DOESN'T 'change everything' like the fanboys say." Just like the familiar card terminal arrangement. Expose them to the fact that their processes will remain familiar, too.

I just want to see Vendors being supported. The prevailing attitude towards vendors has been extremely hostile in DASH, so it would be easy to see simple neglect turn into blame-the-vendor. It'\s mostly just "who gives a shit about the evil profiteering capitalists, I've got ponzi!" Missing the point that their self-absorbed greed is even worse...

In spite of so much pandering to the app user... Even with your project, there's still nearly no interest on this. Much about "usability," but from the snowflake's perspective only. Still... The idiot trolls in this very thread still don't notice that it's their own single-mindedness that is the problem. They're totally oblivious. Nothing to do with intellect. Just obnoxiously self-absorbed to the point that they don't even know what they're missing.

Hoping to see something that follows the trend of "This isn't a completely new thing for you. It's not just the familiar terminal. We've designed the entire experience to fit your existing procedures. This is just another example of that."

Building an optional shapeshift layer on it as an easy-to-use, but throw-away, feature would really put everything in perspective.
 
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stan.distortion

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Oct 30, 2014
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You mean that after all this time, there are still people who don't have camo on ignore?
I reckon he's either working for bitpay or up to his eyeballs in some other crypto. And I bet dash.org is the number one hit for "snowflake" before the month is over ;)
 
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camosoul

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herp derp
Stop DASH from becoming a tool of the evil corporations! DASH is Digital Cash, but at the same time, we have to make sure it's totally useless or someone, somewhere might actually use it for something! NNNNOOOOOOOOO!!!!!
 

kodaxx

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It's not Fraud, actually... It's more akin to employee theft. They took the money from the customer, and instead of putting it in the cash register, they put it in their own pocket. Demonstrate that their business functions don't re-arrange around this. Show them that DASH is conforming to their needs instead of placing absurd demands on them and leaving holes everywhere.
This is a very good point - do you have any suggestions on making this a difficult situation for a dubious employee?

It's certainly not a unique concern, but having a procedure for it outlined is what Vendors will like to see. Since this is a two-ended project, it would become easy for one to blame the other... Or even blame the Vendor saying "It's not us who did it, don't you have procedures for Employee theft?" Certainly, that's exactly what it is, but guidance in that direction would be good. A new concept like this, and people blank their brains acting like they have no clue what to do. They get with the program so much easier when you show them that you're catering to them, and nothing really changes. This goes a step in the direction of demonstrating "It DOESN'T 'change everything' like the fanboys say." Just like the familiar card terminal arrangement. Expose them to the fact that their processes will remain familiar, too.
You're right, this is something we are striving to do with the project. To create familiar experiences for merchants in the often unfamiliar space.

I just want to see Vendors being supported.
Me as well, I have a business myself - and my mother has a clothing business in a small podunk Wyoming town. If I can get this to be familiar enough for her, then it's a step in the right direction (she can hardly check email without calling me)

Vendor support is a big hurdle as well, and one of the most important. If you have any suggestions or ideas, feel free to message me on here or slack.

Hoping to see something that follows the trend of "This isn't a completely new thing for you. It's not just the familiar terminal. We've designed the entire experience to fit your existing procedures. This is just another example of that."
SPOT ON! This is what we're going for, thanks for keeping me on that track :)
 

kodaxx

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Who's going to work 80 hours a week, for free, to make this happen?

Not me...
But I was counting on you!! Just kidding ;)

At some point we will get there. Right now I'm just building out the terminal and we will seek proper advice and think out these steps in detail once we get closer. I do have a few things kicking around my mind, but have to stay focused on the current task at hand (I can get easily distracted lol)
 
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camosoul

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But I was counting on you!! Just kidding
The underlying issue is that the hype fanboys have generated so much "OMG THIS CHANGES EVERYTHING!"

It really doesn't, and you just have to bring it down out of the clouds. 95% of the resistance evaporates after you do that.

Cryptotards are their own worst enemy. They know nothing but the clouds. Reality defies them. They have no clue what the business environment is, so they have no idea how to relate, or even that it need be done... They don't know how to correlate to existing realities and procedures, because they're not aware of it.

"Fraud and identity theft is impossible. No more PCI compliance. No more batching. No more trying to figure out the handwriting for the tip amount. No settlement period. No chargebacks. But, just like cash, Employee theft is still a thing that can happen. It looks a little different from someone stuffing money in their pockets, so this is what to look out for..."
 
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Acedian

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XeMABbcebB5yeZH2HxsV7yLNJA9hbzMgpz
I am thinking of submitting a proposal to flood my local area with these units.
Before I do, I will need it to have GBP support and also the "Ability to have payments converted to fiat instantly".
I can see a lot of treasury money paying for the standalone units and putting them in the hands of merchants. This will please me.