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getting kicked when I'm down... As if things weren't bad enough...

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by camosoul, Jun 27, 2020.

  1. camosoul

    camosoul Grizzled Member

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    I reached out to a few of the devs and people on the periphery of DASH coding, but it's a weekend, so...

    I don't post here often, and that's intentional. I'm on the edge of losing my mind and that's pretty obvious. I know what I'm like and I try not to spread it around too much... Misery loves company, but it can't be pleasant for the company... So I try to keep it to myself. But, sometimes it gets the best of me... What little you see of me is when I can't contain it anymore. I really do try... Those of you who've dealt with me behind the scenes know I'm really not so terrible... I may be cranky and abrasive, but no one can call me a liar or a thief. ...I'm not doing so hot, and it shows...

    On with it:

    I stored a large amount of DASH in my Trezor T using DMT to put it in random locations. In case I got $5 wrenched, it'd still be hard to find the addresses. The DMT config has been lost due to the destruction of my laptop and both of the backup drives. So, the addresses/BIP32 Paths are no longer known even though the Trezor works fine. I need to search the BIP44/BIP32 paths of an enormous span, and compare them all to a known segment of the blockchain with TXes of a certain size. This will definitely fit in RAM. I need to do it really, really fast... There needs to be close to Terrachecks per second... If a GTX 1080 Ti can approach 0.4GHash/s... And that in any way correlates, this might just be doable. Since it's merely a comparison of a memory-resident value and a BIP32 calculation, which is less work than hashing... I'm guessing it can be done fairly fast. Parallellism will be key. I hope RAM bandwidth will be more of a concern than the actual compute power.

    The Trezor is intact.

    If I can get the account and address data from an xpub using trezorctl or some such, I should be able to run through the entire mess looking for any addresses with a balance. Add that address and BIP32 path to a list. Then, I can put them back into DMT and use DMT to send the funds to a new address.

    Example:
    m/44'/5'/123456789'/0/123456789

    I need to search everything
    from: m/44'/5'/0'/0/0
    to: m/44'/5'/999999999'/0/999999999

    I need to pull the xpub data in a manner that does not require me to manually operate the Trezor every time. Once extracted in whole, it can be worked on freely.

    I can then scan all addresses from 0 to 999999999 in all accounts from 0 to 999999999 for a balance, and save to a list of all the addresses and the associated bip32 paths found which have funds on them.

    I can then put this path/address into DMT to send those funds out to a new address.

    Perhaps multiple machines working in parallel on different sections of the address space? That's the idea. Put the crypto community's old video card mining rigs to use.

    I can verify that I am searching the correct Master/root because I have some very old backups which contain addresses that previously had a balance. I can look them up on the blockchain and if they match up, I know I've got the correct xpub Master/root.

    999,999,999 x 999,999,999 =
    999,999,998,000,000,000 addresses to check.

    Every millisecond will matter... It has to be very efficient. All it really has to do is generate the address from the BIP32 path and then see if it exists in the selected list of possible addresses in the blockchain. If it finds one, it then checks to see if it has a balance greater than X DASH.

    Put the address, the BIP32 path, any TXID and the current value in a list/file. It will have to move very fast to find anything in my lifetime... I'll need video cards, and lots of them... More than I can fit in my house. Aren't there a lot of video card mining rigs out there?

    We can also narrow it down to a fairly small section of the blockchain. I know a date range, and I know an amount below which there's no reason to be looking, and that rules out almost everything... The list of possible addresses will be short and will definitely fit in RAM. Break it up into work sections with a forked distributed.net client?

    I'm not sure that everything here is even possible... I certainly can't do it alone. If thousands of machines are on the job, it'll be done in less than a month... Weeks maybe. Those of you who have helped me out in the past know I don't screw around when it comes to compensating people who help me. I'm still working out the math... I'll come back and edit this with a number when I figure it out. It will be paid in DASH, that much I can tell you... I want to keep it more like a Lottery Ticket. I don't want to distribute rewards like mining does. This way there's a chance that a guy alone with his one video card might hit a decent jackpot. Those with big farms might miss, but they won't have lost much if that's the case because this'll go fast. There's 10 of them in this address space. So, that means there's over 10,000 DASH to be found in total.

    EDIT: I've decided the pot needs to be sweeter. There are 10 addresses to be found. Each one has at least 1000 DASH on it because it was a masternode. Which is still running... For each one of them found, the bounty is 30% of the total found.

    So, a minimum of 300 DASH for each one found, probably a little more. The coder(s) who make this happen get 20% of that, and they get it for all 10. The finders get 80% for each one they find.

    Payout occurs immediately when the funds move off of the address.

    That's a total bounty of roughly $200,000 at the current price, which is terrible and likely to go up quite a bit by Feburary... I'm not asking for charity. I'm not screwing around. This is real money. To add to it, since they'll likely happen one at a time, you'll see that I'm not lying when I pay out the first one, and the other 9 still remain. this is not some bullshit scam, I'm not asking you to send me anything, not asking you to invest anything, I don't want your private keys, no moonshot nonsense, none of the crap... It's a salvage mission. The coins are in there. You just have to find them. and that's going to take math. Lots of it.

    A little backstory... They're all masternodes I was running/had set up for a boomer. I already paid him for my fuckup out of pocket. I'm trying to mitigate that loss and get some back.

    The objective is not to check the entire keyspace for a single objective, like distributed.net doing RC5-72...

    The goal is to find exactly 10 Easter Eggs scattered about that space. Even if I only find some of them, it's worth it. But if video card mining rigs get thrown at it, it'll be far more profitable than mining because it won't take long.

    A mechanism much like distributed.net would make sense. Except it wouldn't really take up any space or bandwidth, because it would just be coordinating a really big counter. "Hey, you check this group of BIP32s, see if you find a match. Let me know if its empty and we should look elsewhere, or if you found an Easter Egg in that thicket you get some DASH!"

    Maybe some of the video card mining code out there can be bent to the task? Distributed.net's client already supports a ton of video cards for their purposes. It might be a copy pasta fork...

    I guess my misfortune can benefit some people. We're all hurting due to the politically weaponized flu bs. Who doesn't need some money?

    Hopefully there's no showstopper up near the top of this hair-brained plan... Asking for input from a few people smarter than I... Not that it's hard to be smarter than me...

    @UdjinM6 @moocowmoo @antouhou

    I fucked up real bad... As in, life ending fuckup. I still can't believe it happened. I did everything right. I'm almost hoping the stress will finally be the end of me... I don't see a way to live past this shit, or any reason to bother trying. I'm not going to demand a chain rollback or free stuff, no gofundme, no donations... I own this even if it ends me. You help me, I help you. I can't code for shit... I can't do this. I wouldn't subject you to looking at me if there wasn't a good reason...

    AND DAMMIT! AS I'M EDITING THIS A TREE FELL ON MY HOUSE!
     
    #1 camosoul, Jun 27, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2020
  2. TaoOfSatoshi

    TaoOfSatoshi Grizzled Member

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    That’s terrible. I certainly hope what you’re saying is possible. I’m a dummy, so I can’t help with the coding, but I wish you the best of luck. Crypto needs to be a lot easier to securely store, that’s for sure.
     
  3. camosoul

    camosoul Grizzled Member

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    I can't complain about the security of the storage. It' an absolute freak accident what happened...

    It can be done... But can I get enough people to contribute the computing power to pull it off...

    I've reached out to distributed.net... I really don't think I can take any more of this... For half a decade it's been one thing after another... Not one bit of good news. Now this... I'm not going to make it...
     
  4. QuantumExplorer

    QuantumExplorer Active Member
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    I'm game to talk about the real difficulty@camosoul, we need to have a chat though. I want to give you hope, but I'm not sure it can be done, but it maybe can.
     
    #4 QuantumExplorer, Jun 27, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2020
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  5. Obusco

    Obusco Member
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    Sorry for your loss, I know many will go the optimization way to help you, however, here is my thought : Once, in 2012, a game designer (Peter Molyneux) used some good communication to get people to mine a cube, that was 68 billions phone tap to be made by people (3 millions people), and that took them half a year.

    It's really way off what you need, and by huge factor, but your reward seems more appealing to me that a curiosity. Also, people have better phone nowadays, and you don't need them to click.
    You can indeed put that in a way to get their GPU to use idle time to do the job (so would be a windows app). I see people do really weird things and selling shit to their friend (like wealth scam such as "It Works!") for a couple of bucks (really, less than flipping burgers).

    So that's probably where I would try to put some thought : I would have a way to put a good communication to sell this "Find the pot" game based on that.
    You split chunk of works to be made and distribute through a phone app and/or software app.
    I don't think I would get to the fast route made by a few, because I think it will be too much energy, I would instead go the way of getting a LOT of people using decent material to try to get it : Try to win up to 200 000$ by doing nothing else than using you idle computer, this might works, but I still think you need to motivate that.
    At this point, I would start finding a good growth hacker or this kind of minds to have this.
    But that is probably due to me thinking this is a really hard task and I try to find alternatives to overcome that.

    Not sure it helps, but this is the maximum I can say to help :/ Sorry I can't do better.
     
  6. AgnewPickens

    AgnewPickens Moderator
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    How about submiitting the problem to Berkely and their BOINC node network with a bounty? GridCoin Research. I used to run a BOINC node, lot of distributed
    computing power there.
     
  7. camosoul

    camosoul Grizzled Member

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    I messaged the only email I could find there.

    I've not got much hope...

    999,999,998,000,000,000 is just really fucking big...
     
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  8. AgnewPickens

    AgnewPickens Moderator
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    Yeah, so is the asteroid belt and they have their BOINC nodes crunching location data for those.
     
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  9. camosoul

    camosoul Grizzled Member

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    I posted a message to their boards but it was immediately deleted...
     
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  10. AgnewPickens

    AgnewPickens Moderator
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    Gridcoin Research may still have a chat server, I would try them.
     
  11. AgnewPickens

    AgnewPickens Moderator
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    https://gridcoin.us/

    I would try them, they run the commercial BOINC nodes, Berkeley might not care.
     
  12. xkcd

    xkcd Member
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    @Darren this sounds like something you are knowledgeable with.
     
  13. qwizzie

    qwizzie Well-known Member

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    Sorry to hear about your problems and i wish you good luck with finding a solution .

    At this point i am still trying to wrap my head around it, as i am just familiar with using recovery seed codes to restore hardware wallets like Ledger, Trezor etc. In this case it seems like some specific actions taken on the DMT,
    over complicated things that can not be undone so easily ? Not even through support of Trezor ? Or through Trezor's official wallet software (outside DMT) ?

    I have seen posts on Ledger Reddit from users that also lost the derivation path on their device, they were informed which derivation paths to check for with their specific cryptocurrency (i think).
    Edit : found a Ledger Reddit post that even mentions in the comments a Ledger support tool with regards to obtaining the correct derivation path : https://www.reddit.com/r/ledgerwall...ger_nano_s_bug_using_dash_caution_lost_coins/

    Maybe Trezor has these kind of support tools for obtaining a derivation path as well ? Maybe reach out directly to Trezor ?
     
    #13 qwizzie, Jun 28, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2020
  14. antouhou

    antouhou New Member
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    So to derive a pubkey from an xpub you need to sha512hmac(pubkey, path, chain code) and then get G and perform an EC multiplication on it by the first 256 bits of the hash, and then add a scalar point. That's per 1 address per account. Then we need to do the same for 999,999,999 accounts.
    That's a billion hashes, one billion scalar addition, and one billion EC multiplication per account. To generate the address you also need to perform 3 sha256 and 1 ripemd. So in total, that's billion sha512, 3 billion sha256, and billion ripemd per account in total.

    Given the results from the guy in the article (https://medium.com/@johncantrell97/...ics-in-30-hours-to-win-a-bitcoin-635fe051a752), he cranked up 140k mnemonics a second, but he needed to perform 4k times more hashing to do that, we on the other hand already know the xpub. So I would estimate that we can have about 500 million addresses generated on a 2080ti a second.
    That's 2 seconds per account, and then billion times that - 23148 days on one card to scan the whole space.

    With a hundred cards that would be just a little bit less than a year

    So I would say while it takes time, it's not out of the realm of possibility.

    Given one 2080ti cost about $1k on amazon currently, you need about $100k on cards to scan the whole space within a year. At the current prices, 10 MNs is about $700k, so that is viable even at the current prices, and renting the cards should be even cheaper.

    Please note that this is a very rough estimation, it will take more time than that in reality, my point is that it appears to me at the point as completely doable and financially viable. Proper benchmarking is needed to estimate this correctly.
     
    #14 antouhou, Jun 28, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2020
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  15. xkcd

    xkcd Member
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    Here's how camosoul usually reaches out to the devs.
    upload_2020-6-28_21-40-50.png
    https://www.dash.org/forum/threads/...day-14-november-2019.48704/page-2#post-217927
    and
    upload_2020-6-28_21-42-23.png
    https://www.dash.org/forum/threads/...day-14-november-2019.48704/page-2#post-218330

    upload_2020-6-28_21-43-7.png
    Indeed, the quotes are from the Q3 2019 Summary call, in the depths of the altcoin bear market. DCG had spent the year downsizing (firing staff) and some of those that remained were working for reduced or zero wages, because they are determined to see the vision of DASH through. Instead the OP decides to do what he does best and kick them when they are down with his mindless vitriolic vomit torrent.

    Sure, he may all sweet as pie now that he wants something from the community, but that will change the moment he gets control of his funds again, or looses all hope. Sorry, not even the reward motivates me to help you, instead I will mark your masternode collaterals as 'Lost Keys' when they go down in the hard fork coming in July/August timeframe.
     
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  16. qwizzie

    qwizzie Well-known Member

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    camosoul can be overly bearish and almost anti-Dash at times and his ranting on this forum against pretty much everyone are well known. I remember in the Darkcoin days camosoul
    going all apeshit on us all, when he corrupted several of his large Darkcoin wallet.dat's

    In this current situation he has totally manned up about his mistake and shows an almost vulnerable openness, which is why i responded to his thread in the first place.
    At the end of the day camosoul maybe an asshole, but he is our asshole. I just hope when this is all over, he can finally put aside his trollish urges and find another outlet for his need to rant.

    Also there is (possibly) a lesson to be learned here : overcomplicating your own wallet security measurements can undermine your own wallet security (not sure that was the case here).
     
    #16 qwizzie, Jun 29, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2020
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  17. camosoul

    camosoul Grizzled Member

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    I'd agree with this entire assessment.
     
  18. camosoul

    camosoul Grizzled Member

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    Private discussions with persons much smarter than myself lead to the conclusion that this is entirely workable.

    The model that looks most sensible to me, is a topology already familiar to cryptocurrency: mining pool

    The software needed is essentially an algo plugin replacement. It would work just like any other mining algo plugin, only it does this job instead of mining.
    In fairness, those wallets were corrupting themselves, and the look into my corrupted wallets allowed the bug to be fixed that was causing it. Most people were unable to replicate the issue because it was a problem that could only be exposed by large amounts of DASH. Or so I was told... I didn't understand it. Still don't.
    I always man up. I'm an advocate for manning up. It's a major reason for the friction seen previously...

    My primary point of contention has always been that a project guided by capitalism can't be run by communists. It's self defeating. It's like trying to rape your way to virginity. When a project is ideologically opposed to it's own existence, it cannot do anything but fail. I don't want that to happen to DASH because DASH is a glorious idea. It seriously pisses me off to see something so good be squandered and destroyed by cognitive dissonance. I've said this many times, but the ideological hatemongers conveniently leave this part out... According to them, I'm a Deplorable, and that's all anyone needs to know. Those ideological maniacs will always hate me no matter what; and those are the people I'm thinking of when I rant... They are a cancer inside of DASH, destroying it from the inside.
    Would it accomplish the goal? If someone had successfully $5 wrenched me, how would their effort to steal my privkeys be going right now? if anything, it's proof that this theory works, and there's no way around it. If there were an easy way, then that would prove something is broken In Crypto/Trezor at large, not merely DASH.

    I've never once seen anyone come to this forum with an "I lost my coins" sob story, own up to it. I've excoriated every one of them for blaming DASH instead of themselves. Am I blaming DASH? The mechanism of Crypto itself? Demanding repayment? Roll back the chain?

    No. And I never will. Because I'm not a snowflake, I'm a Deplorable,

    Is it horrendously tragic that I ended up here even when I did everything right? It means my precautions weren't good enough... If I'm going to have security this paranoid, I need to have backups that are MORE paranoid even against myself. I failed this. It's on me.

    Some may choose to simply have a lower level of security. this would be wise for those who can't afford a huge bounty.

    The upswing is, I'm pretty sure the tool needed to solve this isn't going to be hard to make, and could benefit, for free, anyone who finds themselves in such a situation. It also emphasizes the need to keep your XPUBs to yourself... Oh, and your seed, too... More than one forum member has told me they can totally solve this problem for me if I hand over my Seed/Password... I suppose they're the ones who hate me for a deplorable and were hoping I'm dumber than I am...

    Which is why ideological hate tends to lose in the long run. They assume their opponents are dumb...

    So, who thinks this is a good direction? If a few miners decide to throw their 2080 rigs at it, this could be smashed out in months, or even a week if enough show up. If a big enough farm lands on it, he's pretty much guaranteed a very large payout...

    The goal is not to scan the whole address space, but to find 10 addresses within it, and I know a few ways to trim some of it...
     
    #18 camosoul, Jul 1, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2020
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  19. AgnewPickens

    AgnewPickens Moderator
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    Reaching out to a friend on Discord that is involved with some GPU mining pools, he is a long time GPU miner himself. We'll see if he can find a pool that wants to tackle this.
     
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