Forking Megathread

[Sub-Ether]

I do think I lost 100DRK in a transaction a few days ago. I wonder if it'll turn up at destination or back in my wallet...

Hope you get it back, I even got 10 darkcoin back once that had been transfered to the Xcoin addy by mistake(and ages after). Can you work out it out in chainz explorer? Talking of mislaid coins, in the heat of moment I transfered a bitcoin to an exchange and forgot to pay the charge and now its stuck unconfirmed forever in blockchain.info, I am trying to re broadcast it to the miners using a none fee paying node called Eligius as an addnode, I suppose it should come back eventually, well hopefully

 

[stonehedge]

So is this resolved now? Has the fork been unforked? I've been away from a computer for most of the evening and can't see any info on what happened and what we should do.

In light of this I think I'm just going to go to bed and not get out until I feel it is safe again to do so.

 

[Propulsion]

So is this resolved now? Has the fork been unforked? I've been away from a computer for most of the evening and can't see any info on what happened and what we should do.

In light of this I think I'm just going to go to bed and not get out until I feel it is safe again to do so.

Seems like there is only one chain with roughly 100GH/s. Although the cause of the fork is unknown. No update from a developer as of yet.

 

[stonehedge]

Seems like there is only one chain with roughly 100GH/s. Although the cause of the fork is unknown. No update from a developer as of yet.

Cheers. Sounds like things are mostly back to normal then. My masternodes have stayed up for longer than they have managed in recent days so far.

Hopefully the devs are busy doing a proper post mortem.

This has been a mostly panic free fork. The price has been fairly stable. I think its a great sign of confidence in the coin and the team.

However, we need a strong response in terms of what, why and what will be done to prevent this kind of thing happening again.

 

[moli]

Maybe this is something that needs/has to happen, like a surgery, to go from litecoin codebase to bitcoin codebase? ... A crypto anaesthesia before the surgery might help... lol j/k

Are we out of the woods yet, anybody know?

 

[moli]

Seems like there is only one chain with roughly 100GH/s. Although the cause of the fork is unknown. No update from a developer as of yet.

How do you see the "100GH/s" ?

 

[UdjinM6]

How do you see the "100GH/s" ?

getmininginfo
....
"networkhashps" : 97182631580,
...

 

[DrkMiner]

P2Pool Still have strage numbers. weird block numbers. Is it issue of people not upgrading to latest version?

It looks like something is wrong. pool finds blocks, but not being payed. Guess I'm not on the correct chain.

running v11. Done -reindex this morning.

My block number is correct: 207601.

Could it be that p2pools that forked are finding blocks and that shows on the "good" pools?

 

[crowning]

This has been a mostly panic free fork. The price has been fairly stable. I think its a great sign of confidence in the coin and the team.

Nope....Bitcointalk was down

 

[splawik21]

Nope....Bitcointalk was down

Out of dct almost nobody knew about the net issues and as we are all supporters, the active users, there were not many dumping their coins. Yes the price stayed quite stable.
Wondering if tomorrow we will see bct back ot live.
I got even 3 payments today but after all my MNs went down though it would be impossible but from the other hand it is because the enforcment is off so the random payments are in game now.

 

[camosoul]

So is this resolved now? Has the fork been unforked? I've been away from a computer for most of the evening and can't see any info on what happened and what we should do.

In light of this I think I'm just going to go to bed and not get out until I feel it is safe again to do so.

A large group of outdated masternodes is being deliberately maintained to keep the network forked up. Someone(s) is putting a lot of money into causing this.

Oddly, as everyone complains of their mn daemons crashing, mine don't anymore. 0.11.0.6+ has been rock solid. All previous versions were constantly crashing on me...

 

[tungfa]

A large group of outdated masternodes is being deliberately maintained to keep the network forked up. Someone(s) is putting a lot of money into causing this.

Let's pull the plug then !
kick old versions off the network (no more payments + not recognized by v11) and done ?!

 

[camosoul]

Let's pull the plug then !
kick old versions off the network (no more payments + not recognized by v11) and done ?!

Not sure it would even work. The old nodes are so large in quantity, punting them would still result in nothing but a fork as there are so many they can simply persist their own ecosystem.

The manual chain propogation I described in another thread has kept my nodes feeding off of each other and unforked...

 

[tungfa]

Not sure it would even work. The old nodes are so large in quantity, punting them would still result in nothing but a fork as there are so many they can simply persist their own ecosystem.

ja but don't they run them to get paid ?!
so if they do not get paid, eventually they will come back (to us and payments and same fork) !?

 

[camosoul]

ja but don't they run them to get paid ?!
so if they do not get paid, eventually they will come back (to us and payments and same fork) !?

My point is, unless they are overwhelmed by percentage, that won't happen. They'll just keep promoting their own fork with their own payments.

 

[tungfa]

My point is, unless they are overwhelmed by percentage, that won't happen. They'll just keep promoting their own fork with their own payments.

K
i heat you
but if payment is "cut off"
(no payments below v11, new update)
then they have the incentive to join v11 and 'our' fork !

(not sure how possible that is in coding terms)

 

[camosoul]

K
i heat you
but if payment is "cut off"
(no payments below v11, new update)
then they have the incentive to join v11 and 'our' fork !

(not sure how possible that is in coding terms)

Thats the point. Its not feasible. If they get rejected, they consider the rejects wrong and go their own way on a fork that accepts. You could do that if the bad actors were, say, 10% because theyvwould island by probability. But at 45%+ they can propogate their own reality no matter what a new version dictates. Think of it like half of the population of a country refusing to obey a new law. Ther is nothing that can be done with mass defiance like that.

 

[tungfa]

Thats the point. Its not feasible. If they get rejected, they consider the rejects wrong and go their own way on a fork that accepts. You could do that if the bad actors were, say, 10% because theyvwould island by probability. But at 45%+ they can propogate their own reality no matter what a new version dictates. Think of it like half of the population of a country refusing to obey a new law. Ther is nothing that can be done with mass defiance like that.

ok
but if that 45% of a country does not get food and water anymore (MN payments)
they will come running to the other (sunny) side ?!
correct ?

 

[camosoul]

ok
but if that 45% of a country does not get food and water anymore (MN payments)
they will come running to the other (sunny) side ?!
correct ?

They are 45%. They make their own food and water.

Thats the very reson for the fork; they are self-sustaining. If you change the rules, they just play by the old rules.

 

[tungfa]

They are 45%. They make their own food and water.

Thats the very reson for the fork; they are self-sustaining. If you change the rules, they just play by the old rules.

sorry, i know i am not the smartest in this

how can they make their own food and water (payments)
when the environment (code) is changed that no more water and food will drop on them ?
(change v10 to no more payments, change v11 to payments only)

Isn't that what the higher spirit (evan) is capable of ?
As this is not a democracy (where you can chose your fork) !

 

[camosoul]

Their code is not changed.

I'd suggest that 0.11.0.12 revert to agreeing with 0.10.xx.xx

Then package the new win vote system along with a bigger carrot, like ITX. There is no stick option. There is only carrot bigger than the carrot of forking DRK. Which may be impossible. It seems bad actor has put a lot of money into this. Unless someone buys another 1200 MNs, you aren't going to strongarm him. There may be no thing of greater value in this bad actor's mind than forking up DRK forever. Being nice leads to completely losing the stick option, and eventually... This is why I called for more stick previously. Now there is no stick at all. In a world of dirty animals, sometimes you just have break out some carnage to make a point. Too late now...

Its a bad idea because the reasons for the fix were declared... So its almost like the changelog becomes an instruction manual for exploits...

But it may be less bad than perpetufork...

It seems that the theory that it would cost too much to undermine MNs has been tested and found in error. If I really wanted to tinfoil this, I'd say the crypto crash was designed to get DRK cheap enough to pull this off. Would not have happened with $20/DRK...

 

[tungfa]

Their code is not changed.

I'd suggest that 0.11.0.12 revert to agreeing with 0.10.xx.xx

Then package the new win vote system along with a bigger carrot, like ITX.

i know
but can't we do it !
(change their v10 code so they have to join v11)

 

[camosoul]

Break into all of their computers and install our own programs at will?

If masternodes all ran on Windows, sure... but they run on Linux, so, no...

 

[tungfa]

Tx cam
appreciate the "dummy translations" for me

i am :sad: now

 

[Miner237]

what if the v11 MN owners were running some scripts on the MN that killed connections from the old protocol MNs? not sure if it's been helping but I've been killing any out of date peers from being connected to my updated MN and only allowing 70054 to connect to my node.

I guess as cam was saying they will all just peer with each other and eventually it would form the onyxnet?

 

[camosoul]

what if the v11 MN owners were running some scripts on the MN that killed connections from the old protocol MNs? not sure if it's been helping but I've been killing any out of date peers from being connected to my updated MN and only allowing 70054 to connect to my node.

I guess as cam was saying they will all just peer with each other and eventually it would form the onyxnet?

Until they can be sufficiently outnumbered, I can't see a way... even considered banning the vins from being declared valid MN... essentially doing what you have been doing... but still fork, just for another reason. Might buy time for consesnus... but still, onyxnet will exist...

Having a routine with a hardcoded list of banned vins is just asking for a shitload more trouble than it solves... its open source, ban any vin association you like by cut and paste...

Looking ugly... Evanator, be way smarter than all of us, again. Still. Please?

 

[TaoOfSatoshi]

So, if these Masternodes fork DRK, can't we just let them go and continue? We will have the Dev team on this fork, and they will have nothing but old code...
Is that a possibility?

 

[moli]

Masternode owners should be required to register on a mailing list, and before every update emails should be sent out to them. Equal treatment as pools and miners.

 

[camosoul]

I think there is a combination of options thqt can make onyxnet irrelevant and the bad actor(s) will get bored of losing impact.

 

[camosoul]

Masternode owners should be required to register on a mailing list, and before every update emails should be sent out to them. Equal treatment as pools and miners.

Centralization of voluntary action? Gain nothing forcible. Centralize for no benefit...