Budget Proposal: User Friendly Raspberry Pi DASH custom built nodes

camosoul

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@camosoul

Cryptocurrency is not an esoteric society for the initiated few or should not be. If you want it to stay underground...well I don't. `nuff said. :)
Now you're just pushing the agenda without even reading.

You are absolutely right. DASH should be easy for everyone to use! You shouldn't have to know hardly a damn thing to use it.

But, you can't hire the illiterate, entitled 12 year old janitor to run the transaction server and put him on the board of directors, too.

I think Tante touched upon it a little. This isn't a fire and forget concept. Even if you get it approved, these people will be helpless to manage and maintain it. So, hire somebody to have a maintenance and upgrade service? Deal with hardware failures?

They're better off just throwing their DASH at one of the existing MN share services out there. Run by a competent professional that isn't just looking to vote the blockchain into their own wallet. No hardware outlay... Just send of the DASH and someone fit to do the job will do it.

A solution looking for a problem while porkbarreling the blockchain.

I own 3x Pis and 2x XU4s.

The XU4 only has a 4 WEEK warranty! Are you kidding me? It's doubtful that the Pi2B can even do the job. 12 months down the road. Why turn this into an ASIC problem when one can just, you know, not...

I'm still going to use VPSes for obvious reasons... Which you seem to carefully not mention. You're looking more like the Pied Piper than someone who innocently doesn't understand DASH.

Hardware MNs are a cute, fun thing for people who are capable. It's for people who want to push what they learned from reading the guides from "competent" to "fucking expert." Those who don't seek that sort of self-improvement should not be voting. They're better off, for the project, and for themselves, using one of the shared masternode services. Home-hosted masternodes are by no means a practical or economical concept. Not to mention, total sabotage of the very backbone of what makes DASH work.
 
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TanteStefana

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camosoul regarding why this benifits Dash, it's just hashing out ideas on how to get the general public to run full nodes. The more full nodes running "out there", the healthier our network.

So it's not so much a "start up company" than trying to make it as cheap as possible for people to plug something in and run full nodes for the network when they have to time or knowledge about the system, but want to contribute.

I see nothing wrong with that, except that I suspect that we won't get too many people doing this without compensation, thus using them for masternodes, which is cheaper to do with a VPS.

Anyway, if there could be value added services by having one of these, and running a full node were just one thing of many, this might attract buyers??
 

oaxaca

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@camosoul

Cryptocurrency is not an esoteric society for the initiated few or should not be. If you want it to stay an underground phenomenon...well I don't. `nuff said. :)
There's a difference between a user of cryptocurrency (99+%) and a masternode operator (<1%). As mentioned above, there are barriers to entry to the tune of 1000 DASH. If anybody is investing that much money, they come to realize that you SHOULD have a VPS rented from a 24/7 datacenter. Or the equivalent. You need the bandwidth and uptime for the system to work as designed. Running sub-standard masternodes will hurt the network, not help it.
 
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camosoul

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camosoul regarding why this benifits Dash, it's just hashing out ideas on how to get the general public to run full nodes. The more full nodes running "out there", the healthier our network.

So it's not so much a "start up company" than trying to make it as cheap as possible for people to plug something in and run full nodes for the network when they have to time or knowledge about the system, but want to contribute.

I see nothing wrong with that, except that I suspect that we won't get too many people doing this without compensation, thus using them for masternodes, which is cheaper to do with a VPS.

Anyway, if there could be value added services by having one of these, and running a full node were just one thing of many, this might attract buyers??
I think Chris doesn't understand DASH very well. He's suggesting a solution to a problem that doesn't exist.

Look at the RATIO of "full nodes."

How many users of DASH are there? How many "full nodes" are there?

Masternodes are already way over the top incentivized compared to the size of it's ecosystem. At the same level of adoption, Bitcoin had about 500 users, total. They were still CPU mining with no mining pools... DASH has over 3400 way-more-than-full-nodes with roughly the same level of adoption...

This is a very cool idea for Bitcoin and it's clones. But, DASH is already a much better idea that goes way beyond it...

The fact that he even uses the term "full nodes" shows that he really does not understand what a masternode is and what it does.

I think his head is still stuck in bitclone crypto mentality, and doesn't grasp the magnitude of how wildly different DASH is.

Hey, I didn't got full-out Trolljegeren, did I? ;-) I still calls 'em like I sees 'em tho....
 
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Solarminer

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@camosoul

Cryptocurrency is not an esoteric society for the initiated few or should not be. If you want it to stay an underground phenomenon...well I don't. `nuff said. :)
Actually, running a masternode is a limited population. This will only ever be about 500 people since most owners have more than one. (Why only 500 you say, because there are only so many sets of 1000 Dash and we already have half the Dash in masternodes). This isn't mainstream and doesn't need to be. There is no "masternode setup problem" that you are solving, if someone wants to run a masternode, follow one of the guides. If they don't want to follow the guides, then pay for a masternode hosting provider(there are already 5 or so). There are also a ton of people will to help(like me) if there are questions on getting started.

The wallets people use to move funds and receive funds are mainstream usage. That is what users see. But running a standard wallet/node isn't helping the network like it does with Bitcoin. Dash already has the masternodes to do that.

Running a liquidity provider IS solving a problem. Using a PI for this is reasonable and a decent idea. The network needs unique users to mix funds. This may change with the Evolution next year, but right now this is a need. Let's focus on helping the network.
 
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TanteStefana

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Thing is, Evan said there will be a totally different solution to the liquidity problem that I don't understand yet. So this isn't a long term issue, and may not need such an investment for a solution. Still, it's awesome Chris thought of us :) I hope he doesn't run away because this first idea might not work. (still might??) Because getting some full nodes into places like Africa would be awesome.
 

camosoul

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Actually, running a masternode is a limited population. This will only ever be about 500 people since most owners have more than one. (Why only 500 you say, because there are only so many sets of 1000 Dash and we already have half the Dash in masternodes). This isn't mainstream and doesn't need to be. There is no "masternode setup problem" that you are solving, if someone wants to run a masternode, follow one of the guides. If they don't want to follow the guides, then pay for a masternode hosting provider(there are already 5 or so). There are also a ton of people will to help(like me) if there are questions on getting started.

The wallets people use to move funds and receive funds are mainstream usage. That is what users see. But running a standard wallet/node isn't helping the network like it does with Bitcoin. Dash already has the masternodes to do that.

Running a liquidity provider IS solving a problem. Using a PI for this is reasonable and a decent idea. The network needs unique users to mix funds. This may change with the Evolution next year, but right now this is a need. Let's focus on helping the network.
I'm not even allowed to run an LP and get official reimbursement because I'm not part of the cool kids club.

I still keep throwing my coins out there for mixing at a loss....
 

camosoul

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Thing is, Evan said there will be a totally different solution to the liquidity problem that I don't understand yet. So this isn't a long term issue, and may not need such an investment for a solution. Still, it's awesome Chris thought of us :) I hope he doesn't run away because this first idea might not work. (still might??) Because getting some full nodes into places like Africa would be awesome.
My main concern is:

1) Stupid people will fall for this like "we'll give you free stuff if you vote for us" politicians. I'm still not convinced that he's got malicious intent, but there is the potential for serious damage to DASH if enough dumbasses fall for this. With a horribly defective 10% needed, what a perfect way to take advantage....

2) This will become useless hardware just like an ASIC that gets shipped too late. Even if powerful enough, oaxaca already hammered the fine points of datacenter advantages.
 

InTheWoods

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Thing is, Evan said there will be a totally different solution to the liquidity problem that I don't understand yet. So this isn't a long term issue, and may not need such an investment for a solution. Still, it's awesome Chris thought of us :) I hope he doesn't run away because this first idea might not work. (still might??) Because getting some full nodes into places like Africa would be awesome.
Of course it can work. Setup will be different than that of a standard Bitcoin node, but it can be created on a RasPi.

More nodes in the hands of more people and not in the hands of Amazon, Vulture or whatever VPS provider is a very good idea. To decentralize the masternode network is something that needs to be done.

The 1k limit is there to stave of Sybil attacks, to make them very expensive for an attacker. That number is not set in stone and even if it is a barrier to entry for some to others it isn't. Another solution could be found in the future to lower the barrier to entry.
 

oaxaca

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I'm not even allowed to run an LP and get official reimbursement because I'm not part of the cool kids club.

I still keep throwing my coins out there for mixing at a loss....
I'd like to join the not-so-cool kids club. How do I run an LP again? It's been a while...
 

camosoul

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Thing is, Evan said there will be a totally different solution to the liquidity problem that I don't understand yet. So this isn't a long term issue, and may not need such an investment for a solution. Still, it's awesome Chris thought of us :) I hope he doesn't run away because this first idea might not work. (still might??) Because getting some full nodes into places like Africa would be awesome.
My main concern is:

1) Stupid people will fall for this like "we'll give you free stuff if you vote for us" politicians. I'm still not convinced that he's got malicious intent, but there is the potential for serious damage to DASH if enough dumbasses fall for this. With a horribly defective 10% needed, what a perfect way to take advantage....

2) This will become useless hardware just like an ASIC that gets shipped too late. Even if powerful enough, oaxaca already hammered the fine points of datacenter advantages.

A much better use of resources and a way to gain traction in Africa would be to replace MPesa with DASH on mobiles.
DAPI. Who cares where it is. All they need is Internet access... Who says the quorum will even select the node on that continent? Why do we care? This is money without borders or geography.

You don't gain equality when everyone thinks you're special (or an asshole) and gives you free shit.

You gain equality when you don't stand out any more. Because you're equal, and nobody gives a shit.

If you insist in attention whoring for more free shit once nobody gives a shit about you anymore, well, equality is clearly not what you want...
 
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Solarminer

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Like Solarminer said, a pi isn't the ideal platform for some of the more advanced things an evolution node will eventually be tasked to do.

But, I think building some images for people to plug-and-play wouldn't be a bad idea.

In the same vein as NOOBS, images that can be burned, plugged-in, and do all the OS install/config automatically could be useful.

I'd think a single image that could be reconfigured on-the-fly would be neat.

Maybe a menu system with an always-on status display and options to allow for switching between:
  • full node
  • liquidity provider
  • masternode
with prompts (and qr codes) instructing how to fund the LP or the MN.

It doesn't even have to be rpi specific. Any desktop board would be able to run evolution just fine.
The only concern then would be the quality of service on the users home Internet.
I love how everyone approaches this discussion in a different way....
Moocowmoo, maybe a web interface would work well. Like a set up screen for a bitcoin miner where you just type in the IP of the miner in a web browser put in your configuration options and and hit go. Minpeon might be a good start. It is a pi based os for mining. I tried it at post 50 or so and it had a few bugs. I ended up with ubuntu and compiling cgminer and just enabled the web status with cgminer so I could see stats from a web page.
http://minepeon.com/index.php?title=Main_Page
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=137934.0
 

camosoul

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I'd like to join the not-so-cool kids club. How do I run an LP again? It's been a while...
Since I won't get official reimbursement, I just keep recycling my coins... Sloppy... Might even waste some actual liquidity providers' time...

It think it's as easy as putting "liquidityprovider=1" in the dash.conf...

DASH is already way more diversified and distributed than any clonecoins. I'm not worried about datacenter distribution AT ALL, and nobody who knows what's going on here would be, either...

I encourage Chris to get more clues instead of stubbornly plodding on. He seems like he could contribute a lot if he weren't spinning his wheels on a useless dead-end self-destructive project like this... I think he just doesn't understand and still has that monolithic notion of Satoshi-clones and how they (don't) work. He's trying to solve a problem that doesn't exist, in a manner that is inferior to what is already here...

My ISP, after several days of talking to idiots who don't even know what IPv6 is, finally tell me they'll sell me a /64 block for $15 per address. That's $276,701,161,105,643,274,240.00

To say it out loud: Two hundred seventy-six quintillion, seven hundred one quadrillion, one hundred sixty-one trillion, one hundred five billion, six hundred forty-three million, two hundred seventy-four thousand, two hundred forty dollars and zero cents.

What a bargain. Does that much money even exist? I'm sure Obama can print it up and buy votes until we've got the same money as Zimbabwe, his native country...

Much like Chris, they clearly don't know what's going on here, and arrive at hilarious-if-they-weren't-serious conclusions...

The smartest brain in the world will come to stupid conclusions and have stupid ideas if it's running on bad information. Chris needs an enormous information upgrade. He's a Ferrari with water in the gas tank...
 
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InTheWoods

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@camosoul

Not worried about the data center distribution at all? Really? Then let's all use Ripple, mkay? Let remove mining from DASH and use a centralized data center structure to create a half baked block chain with a single point of failure.

I understand you're a frustrated kid who didn't get candy like the "cool kids" but there's good reason for that. Your posts are infantile and gratuitous coming from a guy who didn't believe having guides is a good idea. Really? If you wanna lock yourself in the closet and play with yourself go right ahead. Do you wanna be like Cartman alone in his theme park?
 

Solarminer

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I'd like to join the not-so-cool kids club. How do I run an LP again? It's been a while...
First start your wallet and run from the debug(or add dash-cli before):
keypoolrefill 100000
Backup your wallet.
Add these lines to your config
liquidityprovider=1
anonimizedashamount=1000
Now run your wallet, and unlock it with your password with(the 100000000 is seconds to unlock, true at the end is for unlocking for anonymizing only):
walletpassphrase yourpasswordhere 100000000 true
Now every year run
keypoolrefill 100000
and backup your wallet
It will eat about 0.5 dash/month in fees. If you change the liquidityprovider=1 to liquidityprovider=15 it will reduce the mixing amount and use up less.
 
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camosoul

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@camosoul

Not worried about the data center distribution at all? Really? Then let's all use Ripple, mkay? Let remove mining from DASH and use a centralized data center structure to create a half baked block chain with a single point of failure.

I understand you're a frustrated kid who didn't get candy like the "cool kids" but there's good reason for that. Your posts are infantile and gratuitous coming from a guy who didn't believe having guides is a good idea. Really? If you wanna lock yourself in the closet and play with yourself go right ahead. Do you wanna be like Cartman alone in his theme park?
Now you've flushed what little credibility you might have had.

Game over man. Put the shovel down and walk away. It's only getting deeper.

This is what I do... I drag it out into view so everyone can see it.

@the engire forum: you're welcome.

I don't suffer fools. Fools fear being called out. Resort to name calling.

I've been remarkably patient with you, and have a long history that most everyone here is aware of. I was damn gentle with you. Yet here we are...
 

TanteStefana

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Well, let me say directly to ChrisJ , that we love camosoul, he is very intelligent and always has a good point. Unfortunately, he is .... abrasive sometimes...er most of the time, LOL. But truly a super individual and brings a LOT to Dash.

Nobody wants to put a damper on this idea, as we're so glad you poked your head in here to say hello. But Camo has some very valid points.

However, I still think we need to diversify our nodes, and we definitely want to get more people using Dash who could benefit the most now, such as those using a centralized minutes coupon as a currency. Dash is instant, this is no small thing when buying groceries etc... at a booth, and you need to visit 4 booths today to buy supplies and lunch. So please, lets continue to hash the plan out, I'm sure we can come up with some really great ideas, and we could certainly use your help to spread them! Thanks again!
 
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TanteStefana

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Off topic here, but I'm surprised nobody has proposed funding a fountain. It would be especially cool if the fountain or fountains could only be used in certain places (which I don't think is possible) but if they could only be used in Africa, or South America, etc... I think that would be coins well spent. And with a budget proposal for such a thing, we could always keep it filled. which would be important as some of these people would visit and try to get some funds on the rare occasion they're "in town, near the antenna, etc... So if they miss because there are no funds, it'll quickly stop being worth it for them to try.
 

camosoul

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Well, that's the final nail in your own coffin. You very clearly do not understand DASH. Read my previous posts.

Yes, I've acutaly outlined a way to bring mining into the masternodes so there is no longer a split, or dedicated miners. We don't need them anymore.
 

camosoul

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Nobody wants to put a damper on this idea, as we're so glad you poked your head in here to say hello.
I want to put a damper on this idea because, in spite of how this conversation has gone, I think it would be sad to see him waste his efforts on such a tragically bad idea.

It's clear he can contribute.

But, pouring your own concrete shoes and then jumping off a bridge, while convincing the less aware to join you, well, that doesn't seem like a great idea to me...

This is not a contribution. It's an idea so bad that it's not just a waste of a potential helpful persons time, it's so bad it could damage DASH.

How often have I gone off the chain lately? Hm? How patient was I? Has he admitted, even one time, that he might, possibly, not know everything he needs to know?

I may be "different" but that's because conflict breeds results, and clearly, I'm good at it! If I pussy foot around everyone's feelings, it'll take 30 pages of candy-coated bullshit to get to a cloudy conclusion, and this is way to big of a deal to let go on like that.

I can admit when I'm wrong, and he would rather call names over that very notion while lacking it? Didn't I agree my own gas station payment system idea was not the right way to go? Being able to handle conflict with a clear head is what makes me good at everything I do. I don't have to be right all the time. It's not about me.

If it's that easy for me to rile you up, well, try again. Evan never gets pissed off or sinks to that level no matter how "abrasive" I am. It's the mark of a truly awesome person and absolutely a major reason why I went all in on xcoin, I mean darkcoin, I mean DASH so long ago... That level of character is hard to find, and I sure can test it in a hurry, no? ;-)

You watched it happen, right here, with your own eyes. He'd rather defend the indefensible than take a step back and figure out why it's indefensible. Just because it's his idea and how dare someone say that his participation award isn't special... Unique snowflake. Everyone is a winner.

Learn how to lose, it makes you better.
 
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TanteStefana

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A cheaper $5 pi, with accessories that can run a wallet, even a lightweight wallet, that's easier to buy for the unbanked, but will act like a phone wallet yet cost less could be good. However, I don't think we can do better than the $25 smart phone they've already sent there... unless it could do more for the population? Maybe make a mobile, easy setup and cheap mobile cellular tower, solar run, that can reach nearby villages, helping to create a network. Hell, if it's cheap enough, maybe a village could have a mobile tower, and the huts around it can get wifi access?
 

TanteStefana

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Yah, I know, and that's why you're valuable. It's hard to say no to an idea like this, but you have the gift, camo, LOL. Ultimately, I think you're right. But that doesn't mean we can't do something else that would actually work, right?


The heavy lifting is already being done by major corporations to bring fiber optics etc... to the continents of Africa and South America. In fact a ton of infrastructure has already been put into place. If we focus on the lowest denominator, the users, and help them to plug into this network, that would be, IMO, money and effort well spent. If Dash had the foundation spearhead something toward this, say a year from now after it's all well planned out and Dash has at least it's DAPI set, so updates wouldn't confuse or interfere with users, we could look at it as advertisement and marketing.

There are tons of things we can do. I think Chrisj's interests are in helping the unbanked, he is an idealist (not in a bad way, I am too) in this. Dash is run like a corporation. It wants to see positive results in order to accept a budget. I see no reason why these two things can't go hand in hand.

In fact, our budgeting system should make us the most powerful mover and shaker in this space, if we start to really think of ourselves as a corporation and think about marketing and image.
 
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Solarminer

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Of course it can work. Setup will be different than that of a standard Bitcoin node, but it can be created on a RasPi.

More nodes in the hands of more people and not in the hands of Amazon, Vulture or whatever VPS provider is a very good idea. To decentralize the masternode network is something that needs to be done.

The 1k limit is there to stave of Sybil attacks, to make them very expensive for an attacker. That number is not set in stone and even if it is a barrier to entry for some to others it isn't. Another solution could be found in the future to lower the barrier to entry.
I am correcting your statements so they don't get misinterpreted.

Setting up a masternode or liquidity provider is significantly different and requires funds and babysitting. This is NOT the same as starting a bitcoin client and not ever doing anything. See post on page 1.

More nodes in the hands of more people - no there will really only be about 500 people running the masternodes. It is their choice where they are hosted. If the uptime is bad the move to a new provider. This isn't a problem that needs to be solved. The network already tests the nodes and if they are not working stops paying them. Taking down 3400 different servers in different countries is nearly impossible. Even if it could be done the network would default to a 2.5 minute confirmation with miners solving blocks. Not the end of the world.

There is no proposal or planning to change the masternode size from 1000 coins. Only a few "what if" statements on the evolution doc as we grow into a $10 trillion marketcap. This is like 10 years off even to start discussing it. Reducing masternode Dash holding requirments isn't to make it easier to get a masternode! The reason to change it would be because a masternode has so much to do that current hardware can't do it. At the same time that happens 1 Dash would probably be worlth $1000. So the cost to start a masternode would still be magnitudes higher than today.
 

camosoul

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Yah, I know, and that's why you're valuable. It's hard to say no to an idea like this, but you have the gift, camo, LOL. Ultimately, I think you're right. But that doesn't mean we can't do something else that would actually work, right?
I think he's a much better person to take the gas station Idea and run with it, than I. A little compute-puck might be just the sort of fire and forget integration that's needed to get DASH into that niche that BitCoin couldn't pull off.

"Oh, you want to accept DASH at your gas station? This thing is so stupid easy to use, already has POS software integration for all the major hardware and TX software. I'll just plug it into your network and, aw shit, job's already done, you're accepting DASH!"

We keep worrying about making things easier for the Payor.

We need to make it easier for the Payee. Has even one iota of effort been put into this on satoshi clones? Nope, because they know the 6 confirmations problem precludes any reason to even bother!

I think he's the guy for this job. It doesn't matter how easy it is for Payors to use DASH. You can "stop being a nerd" and "make it grandma friendly" all you want. If there's nowhere to spend it, who cares? this isn't just another abbreviation to trade on the exchange.. I've been over all this before... Take advantage of this, or DASH dies.

Don't just make DASH easier to spend. Failing to focus on making DASH easier to ACCEPT is a result of the overall cryptocurrency failure to be worth spending anywhere! IT's only good for trading on exchanges as a specutroll investment, so nobody ever bothered to think about the other half...

DASH isn't locked into that, but it seems all the people are.

This is the guy who could change that.

We don't need more magic for making DASH easier to spend. We need to make it equally easy on RETAILERS TO ACCEPT IT AS PAYMENT. This is why no real companys, like Wal Mart and Best Buy and Texaco and Citgo and McDonald's and Burger Kind, etc, accept BTC or DASH. BTC can't make it easy, it's design precludes being useful to retail and they won't change. this is the whole reason Evan started this whole damn project.

Redirect this energy. DASH has a valid and compelling reason to fund such a box as makes it plug-and-play to accept payments. Plug it in, fill out the bank forms online BEFORE the box is even mailed to you. By the time it shows up, all the papers are in order, and you're accepting DASH. No out of pocket expense, no nerd problems. Even Grandma could set up a business and accept DASH... "Holy shit, Grandma just made ApplePay look retarded!"

Have you ever tried to get your company set up to accept credit cards? DASH can re-invent that headache... DO IT!

You've got to dangle the carrot. You'll never lower the bar so low that nothing at all needs to be learned. You'll gain adoption by making it worth learning. Why are libertarians drawn to cryptocurrency? They crave nothing more, they desire separation of money and sate above all else. If you want mass adoption, give the masses a reason to effing use it! Make it desirable. Money I can't spend anywhere ever is not appealing to me in the strictest consumer sense. Make it easy to spend the money by making it easy for vendors to accept it as payment. How hard is it to use neckbeardcoin? But if the carrot is desirable enough... We're here, aren't we? how many people with no Linux clue at all are now competently running a masternode? What the hell do we need more masternodes for? We have no use at all for more masternodes! We're wanking it because we're trying to "do something" in the pattern we're used to observing. Constant improvement of what we already have. Total failure to develop that which doesn't yet exist, and desperately needs to.

You're not going to make Grandma understand that XMR is worth learning how to use, nor will you educate her that it's a defective coin. But if Grandma knew for a fact that she'd become 25 years old again, and be married to a billionaire with a 10in dick, she might try a little harder... She may still fail because it's just beyond here. My point is, lowering the bar is only half of the equation. There are some things you just have to learn. Wiping your butt isn't hard. But you still have to do it even if it's gross because the benefits are worth it. DASH is currently failing to show it's benefits. Still. We're getting distracted with non-core functions that don't belong in a currency. Again. We're trying to improve upon things that are already way better than they need to be, way better than any other coin. We're failing to capitalize on the differences because we're so used to everything being the same.

Of course, there are myriad of integrated POS scenarios where no hardware is needed at the customer site at all. But, somewhere, there has to be a server doing something. You're not going to get an invite from Visa to share space on their swipe machines. The compute puck may not be the solution to everything, but the same software will be running somewhere.... Why not state with a completely self-contained system that doesn't depend on the competitors being nice. Do you really think MasterCard is just going to move over and make room?

But, NCR would jump at the chance become the processor, not just the facilitator... They're everywhere....

Make DASH easy to accept. It's already easy enough to use, and robust enough to handle the influx. No matter how awesome you make that new car you're designing, eventually somebody has to sit their ass in the seat and actually fuckin' drive it! If there are no roads...

DASH has become something that no other crypto ever thought about. It now has to DO SOMETHING that no other crypto ever thought about. Masturbating on my XU4 is not it.

There needs to be a budget proposal to establish cash-out to fiat the way businesses want. Nobody is going to do it for us. This is what we need instead of a foundation. I even volunteered, but it's clear I'm not the guy and I said as much in my own thread on this topic. This may or may not need a "payment puck," but some applications could use it, it's self contained, and it's as good a place as any to start doing something new, instead of continuing to polish the same old turd. DASH is not the same old turd, but we keep treating it like it is...

We need outreach developers. Inside sales. People and materials that can lubricate a ridiculously painful process. As much work as the awesome DASH devs do, polishing it to a perfect shine won't do any good if nobody develops a way to make DASH payments easy to accept. We can't outsource this because there's never been anyone in crypto who even thought about it, because until DASH, there was no such thing as crypto that was able. It's going to have to be somebody already on the project. Take away from developers' time on Evolution? Yes. That's what I said. It won't matter if there's still nowhere to spend it.

Look at the uproar BTC got every time someone, somewhere started accepting BTC. DASH could be doing that every 20 minutes... If we made it easy for the Payor, instead of obsessing over borderline retarded Payees.

How about unattended systems? Like vending machines? Holy shit, that's genius! How did I decide that? I figured the best way to see what a business needs, is to create a fake business and try to find the problems. My own business doesn't make sense. How about the venereated lemonade stand? Fist order of business, get rid of the labor force, it's fuckin' lemonade man! What's a lemonade stand with no employees and pre-packaged goods? A vending machine. Totally ridiculous starting point, but it got us going, right?

I can buy a vending machine and stick a raspberry pi in it. Instead of a giant Coke logo, it's a giant DASH logo... Maybe it'll never sell a single beverage. But it'll prove this works. How much different is a gas pump from a vending machine? Or Redbox? Not very...

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2053587.m570.l1313.TR3.TRC2.A0.H0.Xbeverage vending machine.TRS0&_nkw=beverage vending machine&_sacat=0

Look at that huge, flat surface with no purpose but brand recognition... It's the type of transaction where you pre-pay, and expect instant receipt. It's also demands absolute security of the transaction. IX loves this idea. Something no satoshi clone can do. It also emphasizes microtransactions. Holy shit I love my brain.

We could make a promo out of it. Beverages are cheap. We could sell beverages at cost and subsidize and maintenance and electric bill out of a budget proposal. Giant monolithic dash logos pumping out Pepsi and Coke...
 
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TanteStefana

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Mar 9, 2014
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I'm still behind that, Camo, but this thread is kind of about InTheWoods and Chrisj, who have their own agendas. Yes, we need to get on that projects as well, and I'd be happy to help any way I can, I'm just not good for anything, except my 2 votes :p
 

camosoul

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Sep 19, 2014
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I'm still behind that, Camo, but this thread is kind of about InTheWoods and Chrisj, who have their own agendas. Yes, we need to get on that projects as well, and I'd be happy to help any way I can, I'm just not good for anything, except my 2 votes :p
I understand that, but that agenda is not a thing we need. When you look at the RATIO of users to "full nodes" DASH is way over the top beyond any possible need or use already. We just don't need it.

Masternodes are NOT "full nodes." They go way beyond that, and the competence and awareness of the operators is the primary component. Dumb down masternodes any further, and DASH is dead. You don't put the lunatics in charge of the asylum. You just don't. You make it easy for the lunatics to get their meds, but you don't put them in charge.

We do need something that is similar to his idea, and it would be valid to fund it from the blockchain because it's integral to DASH actually being useful for something someday maybe... If he's open to a little evolution of his own... I just hate to see this degree of potential productivity flush itself on something we don't need, and would actually be bad for us.

As a factor of load-handling, we have at least 2 orders of magnitude more masternodes than we need to handle double the traffic that Bitcoin has, and we're not Bitcoin... There is absolutely zero reason to be looking at any more ways to lower the bar for clients or masternodes. It's low enough.

What we lack is a compelling reason to bother using it. Trying to appeal to dumber and dumber levels of users is not useful. We've proven that the bars are already set in reasonable places. We now simply need the incentive to clear them. We don't need to keep spending time polishing that which is already polished. That won't incite use. I don't need your Ferrari, no matter how great it is, if there are no roads... Polishing the Ferrari again and again won't change the fact that there are no roads... We need to build the roads, and this notion could do that if the attitude were flexible.

No other Cryptocurrency ever bothered to consider the absence of roads, because all they ever meant to do was head over to the exchange and hit the crack pipe... They don't care one damn bit about making their currency easy to use for retailers, because they never had any intention of being used for anything but a specutroll bagholder joke. This is why we're not going to recruit it. It's not out there to recruit. It's never even been thought about because no cryptocurrency had the capacity to facilitate it.

This guy has the ability to make it easy, if he would apply that idea to the Payor instead of the Payee, it would have a use here. A thrilling, wildly awesome use.
 

camosoul

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I find this terminology counterintuitive.

I'd love to be unbanked! I fuckin' hate the bank! They are, by will or not, in bed with the guv, which I don't want in my money. Wouldn't it be great to be both ungovernmented and unbanked? Free at last! Free at last! Thank God Almighty, free at last!

Oh, please, subject me to fees and regulations? Please, steal my money at gun point and throw me in prison for having a brain. That stuff is great, I can't get enough of it...

Unbanked... Oh no Br'er Bear, not the Briar Patch...

I only have a bank account because I'm forced to have one by the current payment/banking/government cartel. I'd be damn pleased to stop using credit/debit cards, and pay for everything with DASH, and get paid for everything with DASH.

The only reason BTC ATMs exist is to band-aid BTC's failure to innovate. Which DASH does...