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Should a Dash-PIVX merger be explored?

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Eric_Stanek said:
Sorry. I have not kept up with Dash. What is the difference between Evolution and Platform? What is their status? What features and functionality do they provide?
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It is the same thing. Dash Evolution was initially renamed to Dash Platform by DCG, but they later decided to use Dash Evolution publicly (in wallets too) and refer to Dash Platform internally. Because a lot of Dash community members felt the Dash Evolution name recognition should not go to waste and is less generic then Dash Platform.

Dash Platform / Dash Evolution is basically a platform for building decentralized applications (DApps) on the Dash network.
The Dashpay wallet is such a DApp that will offer Dash blockchain-registered usernames and offer users the option to pay directly to a Dash username.

See :

https://www.dash.org/platform/
https://www.dash.org/dashpay/

Dash Platform consists of Drive (which will store the meta data of Platform on Evonodes), DAPI (Decentralized API), DPNS (Dash Platform Name Service) and Tenderdash (a very fast blocks producing, not mineable, Tendermint-forked, Dash sidechain with its own consensus mechanism).

Dash Platform is currently running on Testnet, but is not yet feature complete (1 feature to go), is still in development and also still in a testing phase. Hopefully it will be released to Dash Mainnet later this year. Last i heard it is about 97% complete (something like that).

See : www.dash.org/forum/index.php?threads/i-think-dash-needs-some-changes.53198/page-12#post-237871
 
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Eric_Stanek said:
Sorry. I have not kept up with Dash. What is the difference between Evolution and Platform? What is their status? What features and functionality do they provide?
Click to expand...

Before someone lies to you... according to Sam Westrich and others, Platform fulfills Duffield's vision of Evolution and thus are the same. But it doesn't as Westrich declared an all-masternode solution was untenable. Instead of admitting defeat, Westrich created a small subset of elite masternodes to run the show, and the DAO agreed to lie to the public by changing the name Platform to Evolution.
 
amanda_b_johnson said:
And @AgnewPickens , yes, a refactoring of coin supply would be necessary on the part of both networks. Let me copy-paste this comment I just left in the #brainstorm Discord thread:

"My ideal is that the two DAOs agree on specifically what a 'merged' version of themselves would look like. Meaning, what exact features a single chain would and wouldn't have.

Secondly, we'd agree on an exchange rate for the coins. Currently, one Dash trades for about 85 PIVX.

So on the new chain that both networks agree to upgrade to, Dash UTXOs remain the same (as in, one Dash before is still one Dash), and PIVX UTXOs become one Dash per 85 PIVX.

That would leave an end coin supply of about 13 million coins, or about 1 million more than Dash currently has.

In other words, if we offered PIVX a deal that they're genuinely happy with from a tech and branding standpoint -- privacy being paramount -- we could 'acquire' them, so to speak, by creating 1 million new Dash.

These are rough numbers, and my guess is that we'd need to offer them a premium to offset the risk of price fluctuations en route to the end product."
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Why would we offer PIVX a Premium for their coins/chain, when Dash suffers from the same market forces and is the stronger project, if a merger is proposed, it should be the other way around, PIVX users offering Dash a premium to join the larger network.
 
AgnewPickens said:
Why would we offer PIVX a Premium for their coins/chain, when Dash suffers from the same market forces and is the stronger project, if a merger is proposed, it should be the other way around, PIVX users offering Dash a premium to join the larger network.
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How is Dash stronger?

Does Dash have zkSNARKs privacy? No.
Does Dash have PoS? No.
Does Dash operate on a lean budget? No.

So, what value does Dash offer PIVX?
 
Eric_Stanek said:
How is Dash stronger?

Does Dash have zkSNARKs privacy? No.
Does Dash have PoS? No.
Does Dash operate on a lean budget? No.

So, what value does Dash offer PIVX?
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Exchange and business integrations bruh, market cap, network effect.
 
PIVX has recently gained listings on many exchanges, and that will continue. So, no worries there.

Business integrations would be valuable. But, PIVX is growing there too. Which Dash integrations are most valuable to PIVX?

Market cap is not owned by Dash. That value comes from Dash holders. It is liquid. It can move independent of Dash Core. In fact, it already is. Dash's market cap has dropped by > 50% in the past year. PIVX has held, while we invest significantly in business and software development at the same time.

Network effect is indeed valuable. But, which network? Users? Blockchain? Transactions? Industry connections?

Also, what is the status of this SEC issue?

SEC Shocker: Dash Token Classified as Security, Crypto Community Reacts

Imagine being a long-term holder of Dash, nurturing your investment since its launch in 2014, only to discover in 2023 that the SEC is challenging the
coinpedia.org coinpedia.org

How long has Evolution/Platform been in development and why has it taken so long? Is it lack of developer resources, or 'politics'? Regardless which it is, or if it is both, how does that add value to PIVX?
 
Eric_Stanek said:
PIVX has recently gained listings on many exchanges, and that will continue. So, no worries there.

Business integrations would be valuable. But, PIVX is growing there too. Which Dash integrations are most valuable to PIVX?

Market cap is not owned by Dash. That value comes from Dash holders. It is liquid. It can move independent of Dash Core. In fact, it already is. Dash's market cap has dropped by > 50% in the past year. PIVX has held, while we invest significantly in business and software development at the same time.

Network effect is indeed valuable. But, which network? Users? Blockchain? Transactions? Industry connections?

Also, what is the status of this SEC issue?

SEC Shocker: Dash Token Classified as Security, Crypto Community Reacts

Imagine being a long-term holder of Dash, nurturing your investment since its launch in 2014, only to discover in 2023 that the SEC is challenging the
coinpedia.org coinpedia.org

How long has Evolution/Platform been in development and why has it taken so long? Is it lack of developer resources, or 'politics'? Regardless which it is, or if it is both, how does that add value to PIVX?
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What does PIVX have to offer Dash? If Dash wanted to add ZK, it doesn't need PIVX to do so, I am quite happy with CoinJoin. And the technical debt of a merger is not something I would personally support as DCG heads into the homestretch with Platform. It's simply a non-starter for me. And good luck getting Dash MNOs to agree to a refactoring of Dash supply?
 
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Eric_Stanek said:
Er .... Dash came to PIVX with this offer, so .... :unsure:
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Some Dash community members came to PIVX, that does not mean Dash came to PIVX. It is their prerogative to pursue what they want to see. I don't know what the motivation to approach PIVX was by this team, perhaps they have a stake in PIVX, I have a stake in SYS and approached this team to talk about a partnership with them, they are also built with Dash codebase and I feel they have a lot more to offer, sorry, they have an EVM L2 that would not require us to merge coin supplies. And SYS head of Biz Dev approached me, not the other way around, it's a better fit regardless of whether I have a stake in it or not.
 
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Looking at Dashpay Reddit, dash.org/forum and Dash Discord there just does not seem to be much support from the Dash community, for this Dash-PIVX merger concept.

www.reddit.com/r/dashpay/comments/1b1n4z8/should_a_dashpivx_merger_be_explored_link_to/
https://www.dash.org/forum/index.ph...sh-pivx-merger-be-explored.54644/#post-237903
https://discord.com/channels/484546513507188745/1212142150825812008

Looking at the PIVX forum only a few people commented about this merger, i did not find any other PIVX social media channel, where this Dash-PIVX merger is being actively discussed. And those few people that did comment on the PIVX forum, were mostly negative about this merger concept.

https://forum.pivx.org/threads/should-a-pivx-dash-merger-be-explored.1961/#post-4855
https://www.reddit.com/r/pivx/new/ (i could not find any information about this Dash-PIVX merger concept)
https://discord.com/channels/312987515076345857/1177091108380090399 (i could not find any information about this Dash-PIVX merger concept)

Due to the lack of any discussion about this merger concept on PIVX Discord and PIVX Reddit, i am not sure how involved the PIVX community really is in this Dash-PIVX merger concept. I feel like most of the active discussions are taking place only on the Dash social media channels, and as mentioned before it looks mostly negative so far i can tell.

Questions : if most PIVX members hang out in PIVX Discord (which i suspect they do, just like most of Dash members hang out in the DashPay Discord), then why is this Dash-PIVX merger concept not being discussed there ? And why is it not being discussed on PIVX Reddit ?

Maybe the lack of active discussions about this merger concept on the PIVX social media channels, is a sign that just like the Dash community there is just very little public support or public interest for this Dash-PIVX merger concept from the PIVX community ?
 
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AgnewPickens said:
What does PIVX have to offer Dash? If Dash wanted to add ZK, it doesn't need PIVX to do so, I am quite ahppy with CoinJoin. And the technical debt of a merger is not something I would personally support as DCG heads into the homestretch with Platform. It's simply a non-starter for me. And good luck getting Dash MNOs to agree to a refactoring of Dash supply?
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CoinJoin != privacy
 
qwizzie said:
Looking at Dashpay Reddit, dash.org/forum and Dash Discord there just does not seem to be much support from the Dash community, for this Dash-PIVX merger concept.

www.reddit.com/r/dashpay/comments/1b1n4z8/should_a_dashpivx_merger_be_explored_link_to/
https://www.dash.org/forum/index.ph...sh-pivx-merger-be-explored.54644/#post-237903
https://discord.com/channels/484546513507188745/1212142150825812008

Looking at the PIVX forum only a few people commented about this merger, i did not find any other PIVX social media channel, where this Dash-PIVX merger is being actively discussed. And those few people that did comment on the PIVX forum, were mostly negative about this merger concept.

https://forum.pivx.org/threads/should-a-pivx-dash-merger-be-explored.1961/#post-4855
https://www.reddit.com/r/pivx/new/ (i could not find any information about this Dash-PIVX merger concept)
https://discord.com/channels/312987515076345857/1177091108380090399 (i could not find any information about this Dash-PIVX merger concept)

Due to the lack of any discussion about this merger concept on PIVX Discord and PIVX Reddit, i am not sure how involved the PIVX community really is in this Dash-PIVX merger concept. I feel like most of the active discussions are taking place only on the Dash social media channels, and as mentioned before it looks mostly negative so far i can tell.

Questions : if most PIVX members hang out in PIVX Discord (which i suspect they do, just like most of Dash members hang out in the DashPay Discord), then why is this Dash-PIVX merger concept not being discussed there ? And why is it not being discussed on PIVX Reddit ?

Maybe the lack of active discussions about this merger concept on the PIVX social media channels, is a sign that just like the Dash community there is just very little public support or public interest for this Dash-PIVX merger concept from the PIVX community ?
Click to expand...
There is a dedicated channel in the PIVX Discord discussing this. Check out the #pivx-dash channel.
 
What I see from both sides is a passion for their preferred project but what I really want to see/hear is an example of what it could look like. I'm guessing Dash only proposed an idea to PIVX but without any thought as to how it could look or work. What's missing is a whitepaper, a spreadsheet, or something to help make the case for the possible benefits.

It's like people in the states talking about seceding from the union, it will never happen because no-one ever has a proposed plan on how to exit the states obligations.
 
PalmTree said:
What I see from both sides is a passion for their preferred project but what I really want to see/hear is an example of what it could look like. I'm guessing Dash only proposed an idea to PIVX but without any thought as to how it could look or work. What's missing is a whitepaper, a spreadsheet, or something to help make the case for the possible benefits.

It's like people in the states talking about seceding from the union, it will never happen because no-one ever has a proposed plan on how to exit the states obligations.
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I agree. Both parties are and should be proud of their project Both have excelled in different areas. That's why we need to find ways to collect our common values and goals. Inclusion instead of division.

Common values
-freedom, responsibility
-friendliness, openness

Common goals
-optional privacy
-effectiveness in development & business
-top privacy technology
-DAO, democracy of some sort
-wide adaption, use-cases, listings

Add more if you like.
 
To clarify, I am not against some sort of partnership with PIVX, I just don't think merging the blockchains is the way to go. Now that I can get PIVX on KMD wallet, I am exploring adding some to my portfolio.
 
I had to dig, and I am not certain I have it correct, but is the Dash Treasury max currently 8,528 Dash? For PIVX it is 432,000 PIV. So, at current prices, Dash has approx $290,000 USD per cycle to work with, while PIVX has approx $160,000 USD. Difference is, PIVX spent years at a much smaller budget of approx $5,000 USD per cycle, and became Uber efficient with those scarce resources. Now with a much larger budget, we can stay efficient and add huge value to the network. Conversly, it seems that Dash has become used to spending massive amounts of money, and very wasteful with it. This has become ingrained in their Community and is causing huge pains learning how to cut, cut, and cut again to make do. Seems like lots of the Treasury is being spent internally instead of continuing to grow their network.

Those differences in Treasury spending practices, would make it difficult for PIVX to justify a merge. We like being lean. It also adds a filter such that those being paid, still volunteer a lot of hours, because they are so passionate, and are not here for the money.
 
Eric_Stanek said:
I had to dig, and I am not certain I have it correct, but is the Dash Treasury max currently 8,528 Dash? For PIVX it is 432,000 PIV. So, at current prices, Dash has approx $290,000 USD per cycle to work with, while PIVX has approx $160,000 USD. Difference is, PIVX spent years at a much smaller budget of approx $5,000 USD per cycle, and became Uber efficient with those scarce resources. Now with a much larger budget, we can stay efficient and add huge value to the network. Conversly, it seems that Dash has become used to spending massive amounts of money, and very wasteful with it. This has become ingrained in their Community and is causing huge pains learning how to cut, cut, and cut again to make do. Seems like lots of the Treasury is being spent internally instead of continuing to grow their network.

Those differences in Treasury spending practices, would make it difficult for PIVX to justify a merge. We like being lean. It also adds a filter such that those being paid, still volunteer a lot of hours, because they are so passionate, and are not here for the money.
Click to expand...

www.coingecko.com

PIVX USD Historical Data | CoinGecko

Get PIVX (PIVX) USD historical prices.
www.coingecko.com www.coingecko.com
www.coingecko.com

Dash USD Historical Data | CoinGecko

Get Dash (DASH) USD historical prices.
www.coingecko.com www.coingecko.com

Whatever merging is supposed to be based on market capitalization, not based on the treasury.
 
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