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Should a Dash-PIVX merger be explored?

Ya. I was just adding info about the difference in projects. I was not implying Treasury amounts are used for valuation.
 
DASH has plenty of stated objectives to accomplish. This would only muddy the waters.

emphatic NO
 
I think slashing is critically important, perhaps even the defining aspect that separates a crypto-currency from a digital asset, and given that chain-locks complicate this for proof-of-work, I'm very happy to move over to proof-of-stake through a merger, or otherwise, if slashing is implamented. I understand that PIVX's consensus mechanism doesn't currently include slashing?

For reference, slashing is when the burnt electricity is not financially compensated in proof-of-work, or when the staked coins are removed in proof-of-stake. It's the bond, or a deposit, that block producers put up when proposing a block, that they lose if that block fails to meet consensus.

The main concerns that I would have with a merger, are that no one get's dilluted, ie. that the market values of the two projects are combined additively, and that the final coin supply allocation ends up with the PIVX-DASH coin swap, or equivalent, having happened at the market rate.
I would also be looking for some logic to ensure that the PIVX chain won't simply fork out of the merger while DASH chain-locks itself into it.
 
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Dash is at $38 and a MN is 1,000 Dash.
So, 1 Dash MN is $38,000.

PIVX is at $0.38 and a MN is 10,000 PIVX.
So, 1 PIVX MN is $3,800.

Or, 1 Dash MN can buy 10 PIVX MNs.
That gives the MNO 10x the votes they had.

Dash MNs earn approx 9%.
PIVX MNs earn approx 18%.

Dash price has dropped 43% in 1 year.
PIVX price has dropped 3% in 1 year.

Numbers don't lie.
The decision is NOT hard.
 
Eric_Stanek said:
Dash is at $38 and a MN is 1,000 Dash.
So, 1 Dash MN is $38,000.

PIVX is at $0.38 and a MN is 10,000 PIVX.
So, 1 PIVX MN is $3,800.

Or, 1 Dash MN can buy 10 PIVX MNs.
That gives the MNO 10x the votes they had.

Dash MNs earn approx 9%.
PIVX MNs earn approx 18%.

Dash price has dropped 43% in 1 year.
PIVX price has dropped 3% in 1 year.

Numbers don't lie.
The decision is NOT hard.
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PIVX is #737 terms of market capitalization. It's down 97% from it's ATH in 2018 (six years ago). Let's not pretend everything is going perfectly according to plan for either project. I'm glad PIVX had a better year in relative terms though.

The MNO and POS rewards come directly from inflation of the staked coins, so I'm not too bothered about the comparison, maybe a combined chain could adopt PIVX's yeild values if that's a vital point, but lower inflation seems better to me.

It's true that DASH MNOs have 10x the capital investment, so would be getting 10x the stake, but also with the intention of creating 10x the coin valuation for those PIVX holders... there's no actual loss there. If done correctly, it would be much the same as if all DASH holders sold and bought PIVX from the PIVX perspective, and much the same as if all PIVX holders sold and bought DASH from the DASH perspective. Presumably if those things happened, the respective communities would be pumped to see that happen (pun intended). The difference here is that we would all be looking to improve the tech, reach, adoption, etc., of both projects at the same time, making it a true win-win. I don't know if that can actually be done, but it's certainly worth thinking about.
 
Well, I was suggesting a much quicker and easier solution to value transfer for Dash MNOs. Skip the project merge and the years it would take to make happen. Just sell their Dash MNs, and buy PIVX MNs. The MNOs that do it first, gain the most.
 
Eric_Stanek said:
Well, I was suggesting a much quicker and easier solution to value transfer for Dash MNOs. Skip the project merge and the years it would take to make happen. Just sell their Dash MNs, and buy PIVX MNs. The MNOs that do it first, gain the most.
Click to expand...
Well, I can't speak for anyone else here, but I've never EVER, in all my years heard anyone in the Dash community even mention the idea of selling DASH to buy PIVX, so I can't imagine anyone is planning to move projects anytime soon. My assumption would be that no one here thinks PIVX is in a better position than DASH, they just think we could both stand to be in a better position together.
 
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Well, now you have. I once owned many Dash MNs, and sold them all to buy PIVX MNs. Of course timing is everything, but I am WAY WAY ahead financially having done that.
 
Eric_Stanek said:
Well, now you have. I once owned many Dash MNs, and sold them all to buy PIVX MNs. Of course timing is everything, but I am WAY WAY ahead financially having done that.
Click to expand...
Cool, but again, I don't think many (really any) people here are looking to exit, and even fewer (if possible) are looking to jump to a coin that's over 500 places lower in market rank, and yet that's facing most of the same issues. This isn't really about comapring the projects anyway, that's sort of missing the point. The only relavent question is would the chain be in a stronger position after combination compared to either chain separately.
 
Eric_Stanek said:
Well, I was suggesting a much quicker and easier solution to value transfer for Dash MNOs. Skip the project merge and the years it would take to make happen. Just sell their Dash MNs, and buy PIVX MNs. The MNOs that do it first, gain the most.
Click to expand...

Pure nonsense. This merger is off, see if you survive the next year, we're off to the races, we have an actual core team, we have meaningful releases, we have an ace up our sleeves, all you guys do is copy other people's work.


copy.png
 
xkcd said:
Pure nonsense. This merger is off, see if you survive the next year, we're off to the races, we have an actual core team, we have meaningful releases, we have an ace up our sleeves, all you guys do is copy other people's work.
Click to expand...

Pure nonsense. Is it?
This merger is off, You know this because your the CEO? (I know there's no CEO.)
see if you survive the next year, I hope both do better.
we have an actual core team, As does PIVX
we have meaningful releases, As does PIVX
we have an ace up our sleeves, PIVX may have the 3 other Aces and 2 Kings
all you guys do is copy other people's work. Oh, so Dash is an original project with no code used from others, Awesome!

You yourself seems to like copy paste a lot, in fact you are so good at it you could implement zkSnarks on Dash in a lazy Sunday afternoon.

Here's 10 PIVX for you or the first person who can figure out how to get them. Can Dash do this? Maybe, I don't know, LOL!

PIVX-FGSKG CLAIMED
 
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Unfortunately, I expect that outcome. But, I really do hope Dash turns around and reverses the downward trend. I also hope Dash becomes a privacy focused project.
 
Ironically, some MNOs will read this thread, see the math, see the resistance to add privacy and move to Proof of Stake, and will migrate to PIVX for more votes, more rewards, and increasing market cap. That value transfer is one of the things Dash can offer PIVX. Thanks.
 
Jesus Christ. Nobody here is buying PIVX, ironically or otherwise. Politely, very few people anywhere outside of your community gives much of a crap about PIVX as a standalone project. No one who want privacy thinks about PIVX, and almost no-one even knows that PIVX exists outside of maybe some of DASH. I have no doubt that PIVX has some cool and useful features, but what we need now is actual growth, and more minds focused on the same shared future, and consolidation is one way to do that. If you really think everything is going well over there, having dropped from the top #10 to the top #800, then I genuinely don't know what to say to that.

Might I remind everyone that if there was one chain with the combined tech, market cap, and state of both, then none of these tribal talking points would matter. The past would be a shared past and the future would be a shared future. On the other hand, even Bitconnect still has a working blockchain that produces blocks, and people who trade the coins. These projects die slowly, but make no mistake, they do still die (ie. go down and never come back up).
 
Eric_Stanek said:
How feasible is it for Dash to move to a brand new chain?
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Dash has had many masternode activated hard-forks with significant changes to the consensus and protocol, moving to a new chain is relatively straightforward on this side. The tricky bit would be finding a set of specifics that naturally preserve the relative stakes of all participants and the combined liquidity and market valuations. How feasible is it for PIVX to move to a new chain without forking?
 
These are all questions for the whole community(s) to answer once we have worked out a way to preserve the basic economics and the logic to ensure a simultaneous switch. I would personally want to move to proof-of-stake with slashing if we are continuing with chain-locks, but if that proves unfeasuible, I have no particular stake either way. In terms of privacy it could have both shielded transactions with coin-join so that nothing is sacrificed.

I assume most things that aren't core to the consensus will be similar to that, but there are many things to be ironed out. In the first instance it's a question of weather enough people from both chains can agree to talk through the hypothetical seriously enough. In order to do that, I imagine we all need to assume the best version of both worlds would be chosen, and then practically list what we each think that looks like.

As far as I'm concerned, as long as the relative stakes are automatically preserved, the market caps and liquidity are roughly additive, and the dash evolution platform still works on the combined system, I'm more or less agnostic on what most other aspects of the chain look like. Nakamoto consensus, decentralization, sound money, no moral hazard in voting, etc., those are the kinds of things that I care about, not specific features per se.
 
Because that wouldn't expand the network, market cap, or community. It's the positive sum aspects of merging that are the draw from what I can tell. Dash is always improving its tech given the resources, but that's neither here nor there. Many hands make light work, and tend to get more work done.
 
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