Vcash has zeroledger which is like Dash's Evolution. They also have a lot of things like variable block size and encrypted network traffic. Once they have mobile wallets they will be ahead of Dash.
Could you please give the url references of what you have just said? Is there another coin on earth with DGBB (Decentralized Governance Blockchain Budget)?Why no one has cited Vcash? People in this thread are talking (mainly the devs) like it would be impossible to have a stronger and instant anonimity without breaking the scalability and that by doing it would "produce a currency that is radically slower " but we see it's not the case with Vcash, it has instant anon, and instant transactions - even faster than InstantSend. We are in better position right now than Vcash, we already are working on DAPI and we already have the DGBB, that they are working on it too. So, I would ask, why can't we take a look at that coin?
Vcash is not anonymous / funglble from what I can see. I scanned the website and whitepaper and saw nothing related to that.Why no one has cited Vcash? People in this thread are talking (mainly the devs) like it would be impossible to have a stronger and instant anonimity without breaking the scalability and that by doing it would "produce a currency that is radically slower " but we see it's not the case with Vcash, it has instant anon, and instant transactions - even faster than InstantSend. We are in better position right now than Vcash, we already are working on DAPI and we already have the DGBB, that they are working on it too. So, I would ask, why can't we take a look at that coin?
Though Shadowcash does not have "instantsend" it has a 60s blocktime. This has the effect of making most transaction confirmations very fast. So, it is not that far behind Dash in that regard. My primary issue with shadowcash is that it is a PoS coin. If it was not for that, then I would have put my money in it a long time ago.If you keep pushing the shadowcash style encryption for Dash, I'll keep pushing the InstantSend addition with the Shadowcash guys
Just look at their website. They have mixing called chainblender and Zerosend like instantx. They are also working on a governance system.Vcash is not anonymous / funglble from what I can see. I scanned the website and whitepaper and saw nothing related to that.
I finally found some actual information: https://github.com/john-connor/papers/blob/master/chainblender.pdfJust look at their website. They have mixing called chainblender and Zerosend like instantx. They are also working on a governance system.
Now that coinfirm is monitoring mixing vs non mixed transactions, it makes sense to look at fungibility with how mixing is performed. Monero and Zcash might win this battle since all coins are mixed. Shadowcash basically has a 2nd layer that is all mixed so that should qualify too. The hidden transactions with Monero and Zcash could be another problem. If Vcash defaults to mixing on for all wallets like they have said they will, that might be good enough.I finally found some actual information: https://github.com/john-connor/papers/blob/master/chainblender.pdf
It appears to be essentially mixing, so it suffers the same issue that Dash has. The coin does seem to be interesting though in other respects. Pity it was not developed with bitcoin codebase. It will make it harder to adopt.
One thing is for sure, Dash does not have 18 months (or 2.5 years more likely) to develop Evolution. These other coins are quickly obtaining feature parity and even surpassing Dash. Dash currently has no network effects or real market adoption, so it is still at the stage (unlike bitcoin) where it has to compete on coin features.
Yeah. And they are already ahead. This monday it's main dev reported that the DWAPI feature is already completed, so they already have Evolution and these features are just waiting to deploy. After that they are only lefting to release the wallets on the mobile stores and they'll be done - like next month at max. Right now Vcash is a much better investment than Dash, given it's price.Vcash has zeroledger which is like Dash's Evolution. They also have a lot of things like variable block size and encrypted network traffic. Once they have mobile wallets they will be ahead of Dash.
And in this thread, they discuss Decentralised Governance.Yeah. And they are already ahead. This monday it's main dev reported that the DWAPI feature is already completed, so they already have Evolution and these features are just waiting to deploy. After that they are only lefting to release the wallets on the mobile stores and they'll be done - like next month at max. Right now Vcash is a much better investment than Dash, given it's price.
Yeah, this is the only thing on development that they have yet to complete.And in this thread, they discuss Decentralised Governance.
It seems their governance model is not ready yet.
Am I wrong? Have I miss something?
hehe.. It is the curse of voting with numbers, that prevents them for doing it!Yeah, this is the only thing on development that they have yet to complete.
Vcash encrypts all their traffic. Don't think applications can snoop like you are thinking of.Additonaly, vcash uses udp.
Udp means multicast.
Multicast means many people hear.
This is good for blockchain ledger applications, but it is a bad practice when implementing a ring signature scheme or a zeroknowledge proof.
This is bad for Vcash.
Zerocoin protocol should be implemented in tcp.
As I also explained here, whatever you do, and whatever encryption you are using, the one who controls the Autonomous system of the Border Gateway protocol, can analyze your traffic and discover you, sooner or later.Vcash encrypts all their traffic. Don't think applications can snoop like you are thinking of.
And in this thread, they discuss Decentralised Governance.
It seems their governance model is not ready yet.
Am I wrong? Have I miss something?
So they 'keep delete your message' in the Vcash forum? thanks for sharing that here with us in the Dash forumBy the way, I keep asking when the governance will be ready in Vcash, and they keep delete my message. And then, the thread was closed for further responses. Strange behavior....
So I posted a poll there, and I am waiting for responses.
^ This ^My perception is that that would kill dash, look at malero. It's a great plus to have a plain, tracable blockchain and the option to mix. Best of both worlds and freedom to choose in any situation.
Besides, more important work is being done right now, tinkering with low level stuff without a good reason would be a waste of time. If peeps want absolute anon stuff they can just buy molero or zcash.
I will give you this, that it is a little expensive (not price wise but time wise) to mix Dash. It would be nice if it were faster and were more automatic.It is time to quit playing around with fungibility / anonymity of the coin. Dash was released as Darkcoin with the promise of true anonymous payment. It has failed to provide anonymity and fungibility almost 2 year later. The mixing technology of Dash is not good enough. It is slow, expensive, and requires people to opt-in to it instead of being on by default. That is not like Cash, so Dash cannot be Digital Cash.
But is it a choice? can it go both ways? (anonymous and fully auditable?)What is shadowcash? Shadowcash is an anonymous coin built on top of Bitcoin technology (versus cryptonote which is an entirely new blockchain technology). Evan previously wanted to merge with Shadocash. So, Evan is aware of them and their technology. Why hasn't he implemented it yet? It offers true anonymous / fungible transactions similar to Monero. No mixing involved. Built on bitcoin blockchain.
It doesn't require trust, it gives untrusted statistical improbability of being deanonymized based on collusion of very highly improbable groups of up to 90% control of all MNs (extreme improbability) This is why we have a choice of how many rounds of mixing you want to use. How many MNs do you think are spying? Base the number of rounds on how strongly you want your anonymity to be.Here is why Dash anonymity fails: It requires trust. Trust in the masternodes. Trust they are not logging the mixes and trust that your coins happened to get mixed in uncompromized masternodes. Masternodes are NOT anonymous, so it is easy for a state actor to target these nodes via hacks or targeting the people. That is not good enough and it is why no one accepts Dash's fungibility solution. The opposition does have valid concerns.
This is not vaporware. A new solution came up when Evolution was conceived. Correct me if I'm wrong, but with Evolution, wallets will access the network via the DAPI by going through a MN. This MN acts as a conduit but is random and doesn't record anything. It simply passes the info packets along like any other node, then the request/info is sent to the quorum who have no idea what IP address the request is coming from. The mix, etc... and send the inputs/outputs to the miners for recording on the blockchain. That's the real flow of information and it effectively blinds the masternodes in the quorum. If you REALLY want to be certain you are in control, you could run your own full node or MN and run all your requests through it. Sure, the MN quorums will see your node, but they won't know if it's your personal requests going through it or someone elses. This is actually possible to do now, I believe. I remember something like this way back in the beginning, I just don't remember the dash.conf entry???What about masternode blinding? Let's be real, this is vaporware. This has been promised for 1.5 years. And despite the code being "already done and tested" it has not been released. Why would working, tested code not be released when so many users are turned off and criticize current mixing. In addition, blinding is not instant. Lastly, even blinding the masternodes will not make the transactions as secure as shadowcash or monero. The transactions will still be correlatable. The ability to correlate gets less with more users and more mixing, but it can still make someone a target.
Actually, the majority of Dashers have agreed that they want Dash to have the choice of anonymity and full disclosure. Full disclosure is extremely important for some people. Charities can show exactly where funds are spent - this is true for the Dash Foundation as well as Dash Core's own spending. You can look at their accounts and see where the funds go, and they make a monthly report to show the community how those funds were spent. You can see it for yourself if you want to dig in (and some people do dig in) This keeps corruption to a minimum. Trust should only go so far!Here is the truth: People demand anonymity. The official argument from Core is that they don't want to focus on this now because it could make the coin a dark market coin which is bad for mass adoption. That would have been a good argument two years ago. The problem is Dash already has all the downsides of a darkmarket coin with none of the upside.
1. True, and I'm sorry that Darkcoin's evolution into more than just a fully fungible coin has been in a direction you don't approve of. Shadowcash, monero, zcoin, etc... are great alternatives for that.Here is why: 1) Dash started as Darkcoin, which was specifically targeting the anonymous crowd (and by relation dark markets. Look at the naming of the coin). 2) It already advertises being anonymous. The result of 1 and 2 is hindered mainstream adoption (by big business). The problem is 3) due to it NOT actually being anonymous (due to usability and severe flaws in its mixing) it also gets none of the benefits of being an anonymous coin because its an open-secret that Dash is NOT anonymous (hence why monero was adopted by darkmarkets and not Dash despite Dash being more mature).
This argument comes, in my opinion, from extreme shortsightedness. Dash changed the moment Evan Duffield decided to quit his job and devote full time to Darkcoin. AT that moment, he had the epiphany that he could actually make a real solid currency that could replace fiat. Yes, REPLACE FIAT. He didn't see exactly how he would code it, but he understood economics and programming, and could see no issue that couldn't be resolved. And I believe Dash will indeed become the number 1 fiat replacement in the world because we have the talent and the gumption to think it. True, the core team is a little shy of saying it, but Dash is working toward Fiat Replacement, there is no doubt, and as crazy as that seems, there is no reason at all why this can't happen. Sure, the Government can say their fiat, which will soon also be on a blockchain, is the only "coin" accepted for taxes, etc... but they will be unable to enforce their highly inflationary currency on the populous for daily use. And in so, they will be capped at the knees in f*cking us over with inflation (a lovely [SL]little[/SL] massive invisible tax)So, what is the downside? We already suffer the downsides of being "anonymous" but since we are not really anonymous we get none of the upsides.
I think its time to finally fix some of the fundamental problems with Dash. Evolution is great and it is great to have an easy to use wallet (which is essentially what evolution is), but having a wallet for a product that is useless by design does not work. First, Dash needs to be useful and actually do what it intends to do which is be digital cash (it can never be like cash until the anonymity is solved).
This is FALSE. It does not take a "huge number of masternodes owners colluding" to compromise the Dash network. All it takes is a few hosting providers that are required by a secret warrant to compromise dash. Dash is 1 secret warrant sent to amazon.com and rackspace.com and the network is compromised.You'd have to believe a HUGE number of MN owners are colluding and spying to have Dash be inferior
This is FALSE. Monero coin supply is verifiable.But on the top of the worst reason to use monero list is that you can NOT verify the number of coins existing on the blockchain as it is indecipherable. This makes monero unusable as a financial instrument
You cannot replace Fiat until you can replace Cash. You cannot replace Cash until you are Anonymous because Cash is Anonymous.AT that moment, he had the epiphany that he could actually make a real solid currency that could replace fiat. Yes, REPLACE FIAT
You can see the poll results. The vast majority of users want anonymity. I am not sure why you keep arguing as if some transactions cannot be non-anonymous if so elected. It is not either-or. The current situation is that nothing is anonymous. All users want is that dash offers some anonymity (and no, the current mixing is not anonymous as previously outined in this thread).Actually, the majority of Dashers have agreed that they want Dash to have the choice of anonymity and full disclosure.
Warrents won't tell them who mixed what as this information is not recorded, nor are the IP addresses. Unless, of course, you have a large colluding group of MN owners. This can't happen, a warrant will give them no information they can't get running their own node. There is nothing to fear here.This is FALSE. It does not take a "huge number of masternodes owners colluding" to compromise the Dash network. All it takes is a few hosting providers that are required by a secret warrant to compromise dash. Dash is 1 secret warrant sent to amazon.com and rackspace.com and the network is compromised.
Please tell me how I can verifiy that no false TX can be inserted or have been inserted?This is FALSE. Monero coin supply is verifiable.
Yes, cash is pretty anonymous (though each bill has a serial number and can be tracked in a limited way) But fiat as a whole is absolutely not anonymous. Dash has both qualities and can make a perfect fiat replacement.You cannot replace Fiat until you can replace Cash. You cannot replace Cash until you are Anonymous because Cash is Anonymous.
Read your own thread here.You can see the poll results. The vast majority of users want anonymity. I am not sure why you keep arguing as if some transactions cannot be non-anonymous if so elected. It is not either-or. The current situation is that nothing is anonymous. All users want is that dash offers some anonymity (and no, the current mixing is not anonymous as previously outined in this thread).
And if a state actor says to Amazon "Compromise those nodes" what do you think Amazon will do? It will just alter the nodes so everything is logged. Or, even more likely, a state actor such as the NSA will compromise insecure master nodes using exploits in the stack running the masternodes (operating system, other software, or bugs in the master node software, etc) in order to modify the system so that it will log the data.Warrents won't tell them who mixed what as this information is not recorded, nor are the IP addresses. Unless, of course, you have a large colluding group of MN owners. This can't happen, a warrant will give them no information they can't get running their own node. There is nothing to fear here.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/4ec12v/if_someone_hacked_themselves_184bn_monero_like/Please tell me how I can verifiy that no false TX can be inserted or have been inserted?
I think you may need to look deeper. Certainly, the few people replying to this thread are invested in the status-quo or maybe think admitting the status-quo is wrong will hurt your investment. However, many people in this thread have spoke up. And, more importantly, look at the pool which condenses community opinion to a binary option. The results are overwhelming at 24/3. I invite a moderator to make the poll voting public so we can see how each user on the forum voted. I highly doubt that someone created a bunch of new accounts and voted "yes" to spite Dash.I'm not trying to get in your face, honestly I'm not, but you seem to be convinced you're right despite arguments to the contrary. I can't help you there, except to suggest you look into these things deeper.
i was going to say this pretty much word for word.And if a state actor says to Amazon "Compromise those nodes" what do you think Amazon will do? It will just alter the nodes so everything is logged. Or, even more likely, a state actor such as the NSA will compromise insecure master nodes using exploits in the stack running the masternodes (operating system, other software, or bugs in the master node software, etc) in order to modify the system so that it will log the data.
Masternodes are public. That means there are three vectors to attack: master node owners, hosting companies, and the actual server (remotely via exploit or physically by visiting the data center). That is even before they start buying dash and creating their own master nodes (which they will never need to do as they will just ask amazon to exploit the servers).
Relatedly, master node owners themselves are attacked via legal attacks such as the claim that running a masternode is money laundering since it is actively mixing.
How many forums are u trolling demo?By the way, I keep asking when the governance will be ready in Vcash, and they keep delete my message. And then, the thread was closed for further responses. Strange behavior....
So I posted a poll there, and I am waiting for responses.
You are trolling. I am telling the truth.How many forums are u trolling demo?
This!It's a great plus to have a plain, tracable blockchain and the option to mix. Best of both worlds and freedom to choose in any situation.
Another conspiracy theory. PLEASE, I beg the admins, prove I'm one person with one account. I will help prove it by posting on my social media under my real name as to my name here. Another poster also asked to be exposed so this nonsense troll shit about us all being one person can stop. I am not attempting to be anonymous here anyways...the pseudonym is more to highlight my political philosophy (Benjamin Tucker was a philosopher who died in the early 20th century). I'm getting tired of trolls like this one calling us trolls through psychological projection. Stop trolling us, thanks. And rating my posts "trolling" or "dumb" is not an argument against anything we're saying, so quit trying to distract and add to the conversation....or suck my...well, you know.BenTucker = xdashguy? Easy facade of half helping but really not. The most constructive criticism we got.
A) It's not only a matter of time if you do something to make it more anonymous...I mean, cash already facilitates not paying taxes for many people. If you don't want the same level of anonymity that helps me and others NOT pay the extortion (taxes), then you don't really want to be a form of cash. And some of us see money laundering as heroic in a counter-economic sense...so don't assume we're all afraid of jail or ashamed of black market activity. Some of us realize too that in about 3-4 years 2/3rds of the world's workers will be working under the table, and rightly so, to survive. People got to eat, screw the government coffers. So, what about them and them being unbanked? Why would they choose Dash over cash if it will mean paying taxes they can't afford to pay? The point should be to make it so the authorities can't PROVE you owe anything. It should be to PROTECT the MN investors by making it so there is no info to get that can compromise them and lead to such a charge. I am losing faith quickly over this thread...This!
It's only a matter of time until you either a) have to pay tax for your Dash income from mining/masternoding and/or b) have to explain your bank where all this money comes from.
Having proof via a traceable blockchain is the only way to show that you don't do money-laundering or other illegal stuff.
That's why I don't mix Dash which is supposed to end in a Masternode.