Evolution will also be a bitcoin wallet

Evolution should move to being a multi-coin wallet

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GrandMasterDash

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I haven't tried Evolution yet and maybe someone has already thought about this, but.. will Evolution also double as a bitcoin wallet? If not, why not? Spend transactions would obviously be handed over to the bitcoin network, but receive (and change) addresses could easily be handled within Evolution.

There is no need for MNs to carry the bitcoin blockchain as all transaction could go through bitcoin Electrum servers. Well, we paid for Eluctrum integration and maintenance so why not also use their bitcoin servers for the spend part?

Clear advantages would be:
1. Great way to convert bitcoin users to the dash network (dash in their face every time they use Evolution)
2. One seed to manage two wallets.
3. Easy to send bitcoin to other Evolution users.

I dunno, maybe I'm just being slow / missing something, but it just seems too obvious to me.
 
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AndyDark

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Sep 10, 2014
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interesting idea. it would mean Masternodes would need to run a Bitcoin fullnode though in tandem. Also the function would be limited to just sending a from one bitcoin address to another, wouldn't have any of our functions
 

oaxaca

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Jul 8, 2014
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Sounds like a good marketing gimmick.

Choose Send Method:
Instantsend - Confirms instantly
Regular - Confirms in 6 blocks (about 15 minutes)
Bitcoin - Transactions larger than 0.1 BTC might confirm in a couple of hours
Transactions smaller than 0.1 BTC will be considered donations

Probably not worth the many hours required for coding.
 

TroyDASH

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Jul 31, 2015
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+1 for the idea, especially if linked to a service like shapeshift (or masternode service) where you can convert, straight from the wallet. Bitcoin balance, Dash balance, PrivateSend balance... interesting to think about
 

GrandMasterDash

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interesting idea. it would mean Masternodes would need to run a Bitcoin fullnode though in tandem. Also the function would be limited to just sending a from one bitcoin address to another, wouldn't have any of our functions
I really don't think full nodes would be required. AFAIK, Electrum is a light wallet using Electrum servers. This would simply use their servers for the sending. Evolution would simply manage the keys just like any other light wallet.

I'm not suggesting an exchange mechanism, though it's easy to imagine this at a later stage. If Evolution is generating one set of keys, why not another? - it can't be that hard, surely.

One advantage would be one client and login to manage both coins. Also, bitcoin could be sent from one Evolution username to another Evolution user. If the receiving party is using a different wallet, then it would simply be sent the regular way.
 

AndyDark

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Sep 10, 2014
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I really don't think full nodes would be required. AFAIK, Electrum is a light wallet using Electrum servers. This would simply use their servers for the sending. Evolution would simply manage the keys just like any other light wallet.

I'm not suggesting an exchange mechanism, though it's easy to imagine this at a later stage. If Evolution is generating one set of keys, why not another? - it can't be that hard, surely.

One advantage would be one client and login to manage both coins. Also, bitcoin could be sent from one Evolution username to another Evolution user. If the receiving party is using a different wallet, then it would simply be sent the regular way.
yep i realized that after I wrote it. could use Electrum. it wouldn't be fully decentralized like Evo though because MN's would be going through small set of Electrum servers. there's pros and cons, interesting ideas though
 

itscrazybro

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Apr 14, 2014
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I like the idea, however by doing so we could potentially effect the beautifulness that is Evolution. When people jump on Evolution there will be no delayed transactions but if we take on bitcoin too then we take on bitcoins problems with it, such as delayed transactions. I personally think that we should stick to just dash and control both the hardware (Dash) and software (Evolution). We should however accept deposits from all currencies by converting them to Dash automatically with a built in shapeshift.io function.
 

TaoOfSatoshi

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I like the idea, however by doing so we could potentially effect the beautifulness that is Evolution. When people jump on Evolution there will be no delayed transactions but if we take on bitcoin too then we take on bitcoins problems with it, such as delayed transactions. I personally think that we should stick to just dash and control both the hardware (Dash) and software (Evolution). We should however accept deposits from all currencies by converting them to Dash automatically with a built in shapeshift.io function.
100x this.
 
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itscrazybro

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You could use the Apple vs Microsoft metaphor. There was no way that Apple were going to allow Microsoft to be installed on their computers because it would have ruined the beautifulness of it all. We are Apple, Bitcoin is Microsoft.
 
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GrandMasterDash

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I like the idea, however by doing so we could potentially effect the beautifulness that is Evolution. When people jump on Evolution there will be no delayed transactions but if we take on bitcoin too then we take on bitcoins problems with it, such as delayed transactions. I personally think that we should stick to just dash and control both the hardware (Dash) and software (Evolution). We should however accept deposits from all currencies by converting them to Dash automatically with a built in shapeshift.io function.
I dunno why so many people are so in love with ShapeShit. But anyway, I guess it's ok for Dash to sit alongside bitcoin on the ATMs, but not ok to make things easier for both bitcoin and dash users in an "easy to use" wallet. But yeah, good job the ATM developers didn't adopt the same attitude, just in case it "confused it's users" and takes away from it's "beautifulness".

While thinking about "beautiful" and "easy to use" software - which by the way is not a stupid last century desktop wallet - you might want to remember the stubborn position Google took with it's homepage' refusing to have more than 20 words on their home page... until eventually, finally, thankfully, giving up on the stupid rule. Until that point, everyone ran around looking up to them like Gods for their minimalism. So, is that what we want here? - isolation? Do you think going it alone and refusing to meet users halfway will get dash into the hands of the masses?

But the real question should be, how much work to expend to test the potential? Is it honestly that difficult to generate bitcoin keys at the same time? Forget all the bells and whistles, just a little effort to see how well (or not) it is received in the real world. If it doesn't work, bury it or remove it, not much was lost, apart from a little pride for trying.

It's ok for us to pay for bitcon's Electrum to be hacked to dash.. yet too difficult for us to even try this.
 

GrandMasterDash

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What did bitcoin take from dash? - nothing. What can dash bring to bitcoin users?... you think "them and us" thinking is going to win the war? Just because bitcoin is so of full pride to ever acknowledge dash's work, it doesn't mean we have to be the same. Swallow some pride and accept this could be a very economical way to try and meet bitcoin users half way. Give the bitcoiners an easy to use wallet with aliases and put the word "dash" in their face every time they use it. Call it a marketing strategy if it makes you feel better.
 

TaoOfSatoshi

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Bitcoin isn't technologically advanced enough to work with Evolution, IMO. Creating an ecosystem that blows Bitcoin away, building access ramps and getting the word out through marketing should be the goal. I personally don't think that tainting the user experience of a revolutionary product with an inferior currency is a good idea. Just my 2 duffs.
 
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HinnomTX

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Jul 22, 2014
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If you take a look at the Ethereum Mist wallet, you'll see Shifty, the integrated Shapeshift function. I've used it and it's really elegant. Shapeshift integration for Dash Evolution would be amazing.
 

itscrazybro

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Apr 14, 2014
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I dunno why so many people are so in love with ShapeShit. But anyway, I guess it's ok for Dash to sit alongside bitcoin on the ATMs, but not ok to make things easier for both bitcoin and dash users in an "easy to use" wallet. But yeah, good job the ATM developers didn't adopt the same attitude, just in case it "confused it's users" and takes away from it's "beautifulness".

While thinking about "beautiful" and "easy to use" software - which by the way is not a stupid last century desktop wallet - you might want to remember the stubborn position Google took with it's homepage' refusing to have more than 20 words on their home page... until eventually, finally, thankfully, giving up on the stupid rule. Until that point, everyone ran around looking up to them like Gods for their minimalism. So, is that what we want here? - isolation? Do you think going it alone and refusing to meet users halfway will get dash into the hands of the masses?

But the real question should be, how much work to expend to test the potential? Is it honestly that difficult to generate bitcoin keys at the same time? Forget all the bells and whistles, just a little effort to see how well (or not) it is received in the real world. If it doesn't work, bury it or remove it, not much was lost, apart from a little pride for trying.

It's ok for us to pay for bitcon's Electrum to be hacked to dash.. yet too difficult for us to even try this.
I see your point. We basically just have to say do we want to be more like Circle or more like Uphold? A place to use dash or a place to hold and use all types of assets.
I love both Circle and Uphold, so it's a hard choice.

In terms of gaining adoption though, I can see that integrating Bitcoin could work but we could also use other methods. For example we could put a proposal to the network to spend say $50,000 a month on a referral program (this might be peanuts by the time evolution is here). This referral method is how Paypal became as big as they are today http://www.referralcandy.com/blog/paypal-referrals/.

I am sure there are other ideas too and all are worth listening to and considering.
 

itscrazybro

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If you take a look at the Ethereum Mist wallet, you'll see Shifty, the integrated Shapeshift function. I've used it and it's really elegant. Shapeshift integration for Dash Evolution would be amazing.
It's amazing huh, I hope you have seen this @AndyDark
 

bhkien

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It is fine if masternode server doesn't have to keep Bitcoin blockchain. But keeping Bitcoin blockchain on masternode server means more burden on it. What's the benefit go with its cost?
 

GrandMasterDash

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It is fine if masternode server doesn't have to keep Bitcoin blockchain. But keeping Bitcoin blockchain on masternode server means more burden on it. What's the benefit go with its cost?
See above. MNs wouldn't have to maintain bitcoin's blockchain and the benefits compared to the little work needed should be obvious.
 

Naruto

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Dec 26, 2014
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If multi-Coin means DASH and other fiat (USD) that is fine. But another crypto? no.
No need for mess up user.
 

GrandMasterDash

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If multi-Coin means DASH and other fiat (USD) that is fine. But another crypto? no.
No need for mess up user.
Suddenly US dollars are more important than bitcoin? If dash is also second to the dollar, why are we even bothering? I mean, just get a credit / debit and do your purchases and transfers that way...why on earth would we need dash? Wait, let's also make a pact to also never use Ether because we don't want to value it too highly in our isolationist world. No euros, yen, silver, gold.. oh wait, fiat is ok, but crypto isn't... ah ok, I get it, lets sink to the lowest denominator and say that is ok.

There was me thinking, central banks can't be trusted, crypto better than fiat with it's controlled and limited supply, That crypto was better because it's permissionless. Bitcoin was going to take over the world.. dash was a better bitcoin... but fuck that, we'll just say that US dollars are ok and completely ignore those toys called bitcoin and Ethereum that are worth more than dash.

Honestly, truly, I don't think anyone here actually remembers why on earth they got into bitcoin in the first place.
 
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chenriquelira

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Jan 21, 2016
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Wait for Evolution release and then Exodus implement it and you will get all of this. A multi currecy third-party wallet would give all the benefits carried by your idea and wouldn't incur in costs and efforts for the Dash team/network. Nice for a 3rd party wallet but won't support it in Evo's official wallet.
 

Bridgewater

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Dec 14, 2014
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Wait for Evolution release and then Exodus implement it and you will get all of this. A multi currecy third-party wallet would give all the benefits carried by your idea and wouldn't incur in costs and efforts for the Dash team/network. Nice for a 3rd party wallet but won't support it in Evo's official wallet.
This makes sense. Unless I'm mistaken, Evolution is a platform (not necessarily an end-user wallet) that allows easy integration of unique dash features through the new DAPI. The whole point is to encourage widespread adoption of the currency itself by using it in all kinds of different ways, not to restrict everyone to a semi-centrally managed, one-size-fits-all software program.
 
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GrandMasterDash

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This makes sense. Unless I'm mistaken, Evolution is a platform (not necessarily an end-user wallet) that allows easy integration of unique dash features through the new DAPI. The whole point is to encourage widespread adoption of the currency itself by using it in all kinds of different ways, not to restrict everyone to a semi-centrally managed, one-size-fits-all software program.
Yeah, but can it issue and manage, say, bitcoin addresses in parallel? - if not, why not? It doesn't have to do any of the heavy lifting of managing a separate blockchain.
 

Naruto

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Dec 26, 2014
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Suddenly US dollars are more important than bitcoin? If dash is also second to the dollar, why are we even bothering? I mean, just get a credit / debit and do your purchases and transfers that way...why on earth would we need dash? Wait, let's also make a pact to also never use Ether because we don't want to value it too highly in our isolationist world. No euros, yen, silver, gold.. oh wait, fiat is ok, but crypto isn't... ah ok, I get it, lets sink to the lowest denominator and say that is ok.

There was me thinking, central banks can't be trusted, crypto better than fiat with it's controlled and limited supply, That crypto was better because it's permissionless. Bitcoin was going to take over the world.. dash was a better bitcoin... but fuck that, we'll just say that US dollars are ok and completely ignore those toys called bitcoin and Ethereum that are worth more than dash.

Honestly, truly, I don't think anyone here actually remembers why on earth they got into bitcoin in the first place.
First of all I didn't say USD are more important than Bitcoin. But the fact is USD is widely accepted. Adding USD (or other fiat) in the same platform (or interface) improve user experience . People can manage or maybe buy and sell DASH within the platform (I hope one day those features will be implement). Provide what user need is the main point here.

Secondly, I do think central banks and banks can't be trust. But I also do think that people can choose whatever currency they want to (either fiat or crypto) . I think this is the value behind the currency competition (or Denationalization of currencies). You have to admit not every one in the earth think fiat is something they have to get rid of. So people do think holding fiat feel safe. So providing option for people to choose is not a problem.
 
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GrandMasterDash

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First of all I didn't say USD are more important than Bitcoin.
Yes you did, you said, "If multi-Coin means DASH and other fiat (USD) that is fine. But another crypto? no.
No need for mess up user.". It's clear you consider fiat more important than bitcoin. You don't mind a list of fiat currencies but to add bitcoin to the list is a no.
 

rustycase

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Apr 19, 2016
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the fact is USD is widely accepted.
Accepted presently, yes... Yet there are options looming, depending on how far they are able to 'kick the can down the road' and avoid responsibility for the incomprehensible debt.
I never had any degree of control over them, could not get them to follow the Law that was the controlling contract, and disagree with most of the policies they enacted.

I would just as soon distance myself from all that as much as possible !
YMMV
rc
 

itscrazybro

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Apr 14, 2014
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@GrandMasterDash I was just thinking about this again and I think I now agree with you that we should provide users with a wallet that supports multiple blockchains. The reason I have changed tune is because I actually view Ethereum and a few other blockchains as asset, not currencies and why wouldn't we allow users to hold assets that they want to hold? We are going to allow them to hold dollars etc through Cryptocapital so why not other assets? Maybe @AndyDark already has plans for this?

My thoughts were that we should implement it so they choose if they want to install a Bitcoin plugin into their wallet or an Ethereum plugin etc but otherwise it is a pure Dash wallet.

I do think this needs more discussion.
 

noobtrader

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Mar 27, 2015
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@GrandMasterDash I was just thinking about this again and I think I now agree with you that we should provide users with a wallet that supports multiple blockchains. The reason I have changed tune is because I actually view Ethereum and a few other blockchains as asset, not currencies and why wouldn't we allow users to hold assets that they want to hold? We are going to allow them to hold dollars etc through Cryptocapital so why not other assets? Maybe @AndyDark already has plans for this?

My thoughts were that we should implement it so they choose if they want to install a Bitcoin plugin into their wallet or an Ethereum plugin etc but otherwise it is a pure Dash wallet.

I do think this needs more discussion.
while at it we could even make the wallet to be a decentralized exchange, if it already support multiple blockchain.