Rebranding Followup

yidakee

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The name is a powerful thing and destroying it and the identity is a clever socially engineered takedown of Darkcoin from our 'competitors'.
The Darkcoin team can not taken out by FUD, trolls and hacking attempts, as they are too strong, this is done from a different angle in order to separate and weaken us.
Consider that something feels very wrong when Vertoe says she is leaving, the core programmers take precedence before anyone else, they are more important than vague promises from big companies that they will use Darkcoin in the future and after all, the superb coders are what has put Darkcoin where it is today and not some 3rd party marketing company.
When the time is right and you have achieved all that the masternodes and IX are capable of, the big companies will not care about the name because by then it will not matter, instead concentrate on building up and strengthening the beating heart of the masternode network.
This in turn, will form the backbone of the internet in the future, and is how it should be,
please do not walk down a different path.

Kind Regards.
Sub-Ether
I dont agree with that only because of Betamax vs VHS. Not always the best wins, but who deploys and markets first.

vertoe has been displaying a lot of resentment for some time. He is sort of the "Darth Vader" here, he does want to represent the wrong meaning of the word dark, with high emphasis on the dark markets and subversion. That can be huge, but in essence a niche, albeit huge.

What Evan proposed has dimensions of hugeness greater, with a clean honest face. We has lost brilliant before all of a sudden (chaeplin) no one ever found out why, but he did. It was a damn shame, but it not the end of the world. Not to mention the Ape-shit (pun intended)

And while yes, a company name has a (legal) product and brands it silly and it is a champion, good on them!
When its a financial instrument, we can never hope to deploy big with the name Darkcoin, that is self-evident!

A like I said so many times, one does not negate the other. We can have a clean face, and the code and infrastructure in place to help out on the deep web, be it subversion, or empowering the oppressed, while say, have a third party fully loaded with AML practicing a totally different game. But they'll never get an AML with a coin named Darkcoin.

vertoe, pleeease chill out and come back and participate in this debate, at least.
 
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ANAEDV

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I think the name eCash would work well, it’s simple and explains exactly what Darkcoin is about (electronic cash). I’ve seen a few community members mention this name whenever discussions about renaming have happened and for me this would be perfect.
What Milton Friedman predicted is essentially what Darkcoin has become:
Can anyone think of any reason why this name couldn’t be used?
 

yidakee

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Because it sound exactly like it looks. Early 1980's. For that I much rather use Dash.
 
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yidakee

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Few things from btct:
"DAPS( Digital Anonymous Payment System)"
I like shift to "Payment System" from "Coin" or even from "Cash"
"sending money would then be dapping"
Also like that part.

and just for fun: DARPASYS (Digital Anonymous Reliable PAyment SYStem) (yes, it's DARPA inside;))
That will have essentially the same fundamental issue here, the looming ghost over it's name.

DASH says it all now, comparing to VISA, SWIFT, Mastercard, Paypal ... essentially all protocols with or without features, something "clean" and "empowering" to the general population, with instant appeal would be nice.

SAFE - Secure, Anonymous, Fungible Exchange ... I hate this one now, 'cos its not cool at all, explains too much and leaves even more out.

But it definitely has to be something fast, phonetically snappy, and idiot proof if we're going to do this, and in that regard, DASH does fit the bill perfectly.

And the point is we CAN legitimately say that we're digital cash as we're happily fungible.
 
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sangoku

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CHANGE Cryptocurrency with Hyper Anonymity and Nippy for Global Exchanges
 

sangoku

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D-Change Digital Currency with Hyper Anonymity and Nippy for Global Exchanges
 

alex-ru

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Excuse me, let me repeat:

When you are going to create successful project - you must forget what you like or dislike - you have to be oriented to what like or dislike majority of your potential clients. This coin is created not for current users (developers, investors, traders, ...) - but for mass sector (people who still even don’t know about DRK).

We need to trust people like Minotaur, Fernando, tungfa, TaoofSatoshi, ... because they are working in the field and have practical understanding what potential users and partners want. (And they are even more competent in this question than professional marketing and branding agencies with just theoretical knowledge in crypto).

If you don’t trust them and it is not obvious for you that «some-new-name» is better than "darkcoin" - everybody can make his own research regarding this (find new people and try to "sell" them same project with different names and decide the most effective name).
 

balu

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Oct 9, 2014
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Excuse me, let me repeat:

When you are going to create successful project - you must forget what you like or dislike - you have to be oriented to what like or dislike majority of your potential clients. This coin is created not for current users (developers, investors, traders, ...) - but for mass sector (people who still even don’t know about DRK).

We need to trust people like Minotaur, Fernando, tungfa, TaoofSatoshi, ... because they are working in the field and have practical understanding want potential users and partners want. (And they are even more competent in this question than professional marketing and branding agencies with just theoretical knowledge in crypto).

If you don’t trust them and it is not obvious for you that «some-new-name» is better than "darkcoin" - everybody can make his own research regarding this (find new people and try to "sell" them same project with different names and decide the most effective name).
Sure. But this is only one side of the coin. The rest I've already explained. Most people were upset not about the "what" (the idea of the name change), but about the "how".
 

alex-ru

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Sure. But this is only one side of the coin. The rest I've already explained. Most people were upset not about the "what" (the idea of the name change), but about the "how".
Totally agree. Of course people don't have to feel "being ignored".

I am so sorry about vertoe's emotional dump. This situation reminds me one more time that emotions must be switched off when you are dealing with money. And if somebody wants to exit - it may be more effective way of doing it.
 
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duffman

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Jan 17, 2015
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Oh boy, now whenever I hear the so called experts talking seriously about money I will point them out to this brand issue. Humanity is sooo predictable.
If investors are scared by the name, then it is easy to draw the conclusion. They are a bunch of cowards and idiots without any short-term or long-term vision. I'm not a member of that group, of course *sticks chest out proudly*.

The situation can be summed up with this discussion:
- Evan: Hey, guys. You know about all those repositories you have been working on?
- Board of devs: Yes, we do.
- Evan: Good. (Greedy) Investors want us to ditch the original name and start fresh, so we will rename them all. Surprise!
- Board of devs: Yay! Hooray for them!

Did you honestly think that would be the reaction? I surely hope not. People tend to get attached with their work. It is called sensitivity, an irrational human feeling most of us tend to fall easily into. The cold truth is that investors do not care about a name or what it stands for. Tthe most important proprietary computer manufacturer in China is solely based in pure advertising, for frigging sake.

Let's get this straight. Online payment sytems suck big time. It is the most burocratic network you will stumble upon: exasperating long times of transactions, paleolithic web design, insufferable navigation, comissions for each operation (adjusted by someones' whim at the end of the month), micropayments are prohibitive, etc. etc. If you use DRK or BTC, there is no going back. However, there are pending issues:
  • The conflict between technology and brand has not been solved since the beginning. Don't treat the symptoms as a regular quack that leaves the body of the patient with all the pernicious side effects. You need to find the cause or nothing will ever change. A compromise between them must be achieved as soon as possible. Either DarkCoin/DRK or whatever is associated with the underlying tech and other name for the ecosystem or viceversa (e.g. the Trisquel distro and the GNU Linux kernel).
  • Users do not deal with standards or manuals. Concepts like DarkSend should be not shown in the UI (a untraceability level -high, medium, low- should be more than enough). The same could be said for any technical term.
  • Do you want a bigger user base? OK then, internationalization is mandatory for that purpose. The main website needs an overhaul. Visitors can see there is not a lot of movement in the subforums, and that's an understatement.
  • How do you get (earn, buy or sell) coins easily? Exchanges are the first point of contact. Do you have plans for a DRK bike, guys? Your grandma is not going to use cryptocurrency software at this stage. End of the story. Old people are not going to "mix coins".
  • The quantity of software available is large. Three clients (the official DRK QT wallet and two lightweight versions: darkcoil and the multi-coin wallet called encompass), different public ledger explorers (chainz, explorer.darkcoin.io, blockchains.io) and administration apps (drk.mn, darkcoind-ncurses). Custom configurations should be easily tailored to the user profile. For instance, a demo can be launched with an InstantX and instant setup with only a few clicks. Are you interested in a privacy configuration? Get a usb stick with your favorite linux distro. And so on...
Keep the focus on what's important right now. Small community is a synonym of realistic point of view. Oh, an I agree with the main point of the original post: "There is a lot of potential for aggressive expansion."

Just my two duffs.
 

strix

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Sep 14, 2014
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The Shadow Lands
Few things from btct:
"DAPS( Digital Anonymous Payment System)"
I like shift to "Payment System" from "Coin" or even from "Cash"
"sending money would then be dapping"
Also like that part.

and just for fun: DARPASYS (Digital Anonymous Reliable PAyment SYStem) (yes, it's DARPA inside;))
...Trying desperately to catch up.:confused:
Hope to add something truly more constructive later. FWIW--DARPA holds some potential.:tongue: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DARPA
 

Varvarin

New Member
Feb 1, 2015
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Nice trolling there Duffman (Evan not that poster above I just noticed), shake em unbelievers out. - I would buy Wankcoin if it was made by DarkTeam :tongue:

Oh and so much fun past 24h .. even the name rage was hilarious and .. thanks for the avatar .. heh :what:
 

Sub-Ether

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Mar 31, 2014
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Nice trolling there Duffman (Evan not that poster above I just noticed), shake em unbelievers out. - I would buy Wankcoin if it was made by DarkTeam :tongue:

Oh and so much fun past 24h .. even the name rage was hilarious and .. thanks for the avatar .. heh :what:
Duffman made some good points, stop trying to divide us, I can see what you are doing.
 

strix

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Sep 14, 2014
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My two duffs: Keep the D logo, it is well recognized, and inoffensive; also keep the conjoined IX logo of instant exchange, it is both descriptive and elegant from a design perspective. DX is often a designator for products associated with quality, and also rapid long-distance communication (DIX is an option here but could be confused with a sexual slur—of course in that regard it is no worse than “Space Exploration Technology Corp. usually referred to as SpaceX—a term that always causes my children to snicker.)

If a way can be found to incorporate an L, you could have “DLX” or “DeLuXe” or simply DeluXe, using the D and IX symbols. Deluxe by the way means : of special elegance, sumptuousness, or fineness; high or highest in quality, luxury, etc. (personally I like that it derives from the Latin “of/from light.”)

These are just ideas for consideration—but I also wholeheartedly endorse Evan’s idea of hiring a professional marketing firm with branding expertise.

FWIW; another def. of Deluxe: of better quality and usually more expensive than the usual ones of its kind : very luxurious. Sounds like our coin to me! :cool:
 

AndyDark

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Sep 10, 2014
353
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i feel for the people who feel emotional about changing a name they have come to love, but Evan is right - businesses won't touch 'Darkcoin' and the average person thinks it's dodgy just from the name.

Dash is very clever name, it conveys 3 things:

1. anonymity because cash is anonymous, Bitcoin isn't

2. digital, so average person can get that it's internet currency

3. it's quick - which is our real Bitcoin killer app isn't it??? (coupled with not having the 7-transaction per second limit of bitcoin)

Comon people this is our chance to take on Bitcoin and still deliver all the libertarian side - but to stay on top we have to be business and market friendly this is just reality!!! :D
 

yidakee

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Apr 16, 2014
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i feel for the people who feel emotional about changing a name they have come to love, but Evan is right - businesses won't touch 'Darkcoin' and the average person thinks it's dodgy just from the name.

Dash is very clever name, it conveys 3 things:

1. anonymity because cash is anonymous, Bitcoin isn't

2. digital, so average person can get that it's internet currency

3. it's quick - which is our real Bitcoin killer app isn't it??? (coupled with not having the 7-transaction per second limit of bitcoin)

Comon people this is our chance to take on Bitcoin and still deliver all the libertarian side - but to stay on top we have to be business and market friendly this is just reality!!! :D
+1
 

djcrypto

Member
May 27, 2014
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I think the name eCash would work well, it’s simple and explains exactly what Darkcoin is about (electronic cash). I’ve seen a few community members mention this name whenever discussions about renaming have happened and for me this would be perfect.
What Milton Friedman predicted is essentially what Darkcoin has become:
Can anyone think of any reason why this name couldn’t be used?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecash
 

RenegadeMan

Member
Aug 6, 2014
61
92
58
Oh boy, now whenever I hear the so called experts talking seriously about money I will point them out to this brand issue. Humanity is sooo predictable.
If investors are scared by the name, then it is easy to draw the conclusion. They are a bunch of cowards and idiots without any short-term or long-term vision. I'm not a member of that group, of course *sticks chest out proudly*.

The situation can be summed up with this discussion:
- Evan: Hey, guys. You know about all those repositories you have been working on?
- Board of devs: Yes, we do.
- Evan: Good. (Greedy) Investors want us to ditch the original name and start fresh, so we will rename them all. Surprise!
- Board of devs: Yay! Hooray for them!

Did you honestly think that would be the reaction? I surely hope not. People tend to get attached with their work. It is called sensitivity, an irrational human feeling most of us tend to fall easily into. The cold truth is that investors do not care about a name or what it stands for. Tthe most important proprietary computer manufacturer in China is solely based in pure advertising, for frigging sake.

Let's get this straight. Online payment sytems suck big time. It is the most burocratic network you will stumble upon: exasperating long times of transactions, paleolithic web design, insufferable navigation, comissions for each operation (adjusted by someones' whim at the end of the month), micropayments are prohibitive, etc. etc. If you use DRK or BTC, there is no going back. However, there are pending issues:
  • The conflict between technology and brand has not been solved since the beginning. Don't treat the symptoms as a regular quack that leaves the body of the patient with all the pernicious side effects. You need to find the cause or nothing will ever change. A compromise between them must be achieved as soon as possible. Either DarkCoin/DRK or whatever is associated with the underlying tech and other name for the ecosystem or viceversa (e.g. the Trisquel distro and the GNU Linux kernel).
  • Users do not deal with standards or manuals. Concepts like DarkSend should be not shown in the UI (a untraceability level -high, medium, low- should be more than enough). The same could be said for any technical term.
  • Do you want a bigger user base? OK then, internationalization is mandatory for that purpose. The main website needs an overhaul. Visitors can see there is not a lot of movement in the subforums, and that's an understatement.
  • How do you get (earn, buy or sell) coins easily? Exchanges are the first point of contact. Do you have plans for a DRK bike, guys? Your grandma is not going to use cryptocurrency software at this stage. End of the story. Old people are not going to "mix coins".
  • The quantity of software available is large. Three clients (the official DRK QT wallet and two lightweight versions: darkcoil and the multi-coin wallet called encompass), different public ledger explorers (chainz, explorer.darkcoin.io, blockchains.io) and administration apps (drk.mn, darkcoind-ncurses). Custom configurations should be easily tailored to the user profile. For instance, a demo can be launched with an InstantX and instant setup with only a few clicks. Are you interested in a privacy configuration? Get a usb stick with your favorite linux distro. And so on...
Keep the focus on what's important right now. Small community is a synonym of realistic point of view. Oh, an I agree with the main point of the original post: "There is a lot of potential for aggressive expansion."

Just my two duffs.
Duffman you have some interesting points in your post but with this:
If investors are scared by the name, then it is easy to draw the conclusion. They are a bunch of cowards and idiots without any short-term or long-term vision. I'm not a member of that group, of course *sticks chest out proudly*.
....goodness; I think you have the wrong idea altogether.

This whole discussion is not about a group of investors who are "cowards and idiots" and you needing to "stick (your) chest out proudly" to demonstrate you're not part of such a group.

The essence of the overall exercise in looking to undergo a name change is that "Darkcoin" isn't a name that will ever achieve widespread adoption because it's too suggestive of the currency being involved in nefarious or illegal activities. Mainstream businesses, institutions and organisations simply won't adopt and use it because it sounds like they'd be supporting Silk Road-style online criminal activity which is completely unacceptable for public companies and mainstream commercial enterprises.

With a different name that's more universally acceptable to law abiding people who wouldn't even look at a dark market website, let alone purchase something there, we're opening ourselves up to adoption on a scale infinitely above what we'd achieve as a dark market focussed crypto.

That's what it's about.
 
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coinBR

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Mar 10, 2015
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Hello Everyone,

I wanted to just follow up with the rebranding discussion that the community has been having since I posted yesterday and clarify some misconceptions that are going around in the community.

First thing is, the name change isn’t final. We’re opening this up to discussion by the community, the only thing that’s known at this time is the name “Darkcoin” has some negative perception by businesses we’ve reached out to. They’ve said, it’s not the privacy centric nature of the product, but the name that is unfortunate.

The name “Dash” was recommended by the community some time ago. We picked up on that and the foundation began investigating the use of it and found a trademark application. The whole reason we’ve acquired the rights, was not because the decision was final, but because we need to challenge that trademark application to even be able to use the name, otherwise it’s a complete non-starter.

We’re absolutely open to everyone’s input and always have been. We would like this process to be 100% transparent as possible. In the community supports it, I would support hiring a firm to handle the rebranding for us. We could allow the firm to engage directly and transparently with the community, then have foundation members vote on the final decision.

Originally when the community started talking about rebranding months ago, we also began talking about it internally. It’s obvious that we missed something in the process and I’d also like to apologize on behalf of myself and the foundation’s board for this.
Why not just DCOIN! Or how about to hire a company to help in re-do it.
 

r-ando

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Hmm... I noticed they don't use a capital E, not sure if that makes a difference. So the patents for that digicash ecash concept are now owned by Bluecora.. but there doesn't seem to be a company called Ecash and also when they tried to implement ecash they called it Digicash. (ecash was essentially the concept from what I understand, its easy to protect company names, product names, but concepts? Implemented differently?...)
 
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coinBR

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Mar 10, 2015
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DCOIN that way we do run from logo or any thing like that. And also the name suggest "The" coin. But if guys decide to hire a company I will be more the happy to help with some donations.
 
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bigrcanada

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www.misconductwineco.com
Hello Everyone,

I wanted to just follow up with the rebranding discussion that the community has been having since I posted yesterday and clarify some misconceptions that are going around in the community.

First thing is, the name change isn’t final. We’re opening this up to discussion by the community, the only thing that’s known at this time is the name “Darkcoin” has some negative perception by businesses we’ve reached out to. They’ve said, it’s not the privacy centric nature of the product, but the name that is unfortunate.

The name “Dash” was recommended by the community some time ago. We picked up on that and the foundation began investigating the use of it and found a trademark application. The whole reason we’ve acquired the rights, was not because the decision was final, but because we need to challenge that trademark application to even be able to use the name, otherwise it’s a complete non-starter.

We’re absolutely open to everyone’s input and always have been. We would like this process to be 100% transparent as possible. In the community supports it, I would support hiring a firm to handle the rebranding for us. We could allow the firm to engage directly and transparently with the community, then have foundation members vote on the final decision.

Originally when the community started talking about rebranding months ago, we also began talking about it internally. It’s obvious that we missed something in the process and I’d also like to apologize on behalf of myself and the foundation’s board for this.
Evan...your on the right track. Being the leader of a project or business is tough and you have to make many tough decisions. I do daily. There is always a cause and effect...

... making hard decisions and sticking with it even if it's not popular is the mark of a truly good leader. Go with your gut... Consult those around you that you trust and be clear and decisive.

There is no path that you can take now that you won't lose some people... It's unfortunate but the bigger picture is what should be your guiding light.

There are many many peeps, what I call the silent majority that believe in what you want to accomplish. Cheers!
 

alex-ru

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Jul 14, 2014
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DCOIN that way we do run from logo or any thing like that. And also the name suggest "The" coin. But if guys decide to hire a company I will be more the happy to help with some donations.
sorry bro, but:

Is it only my impression that some new-comers specially direct us to the wrong way? ;)
 
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coinBR

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Mar 10, 2015
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sorry bro, but:

Is it only my impression that some new-comers specially direct us to the wrong way? ;)
Looks like, here in Brasil everywhere I try to talk about darkcoin people don't like the name and most of them get the impression that is ilegal (black-market). We are investing a lot in mining and also in developing a payments system so the market could also accept DRK. We are complete behind DRK, and I hope that I can help more.
 

r-ando

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Forget consultants in my opinion, waste of time and money. Thats a terrible idea in my opinion, except if you pay him only once the job is done and you are satisfied... lol we wish! First you get a consultant, then you get another consultant who knows better than the first consultant... Then a team of consultants convince you they can do even better for you etc...
 
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