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November 2015 Budget Proposal

Discussion in 'Official Announcements' started by eduffield, Oct 29, 2015.

  1. eduffield

    eduffield Core Developer

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    It’s that time again, here are the Core Team budget proposals for this month. We’ve made some great progress which should be visible in the next 2-3 months. It’s going to take a bit, because we need a ton of work done all at the same time to achieve the results we’re looking for.

    Previous Items

    1. Electrum Client/Server Implementation (major development part completed)
      We’ve released the Electrum Beta1 release on mainnet, you can see that here: https://dashtalk.org/threads/dash-electrum-release-v0-2-4-1.6497/
    2. Core Team Budget - $2904 - 1176 DASH
    3. Public Awareness Campaign - $5500 (ongoing)
      We’ve been working on our public awareness campaign, which is getting highly organized. You can see more information about this here: https://dashtalk.org/threads/dash-project-expenses-community-report-september-2015.6486/
    4. Liquidity Providers - $300
      We have created a new team to support the network by providing liquidity for the mixing on the network. Results for mixing on the network look promising, users have reported being able to mix in a few hours instead of days.

    New Proposal Items:

    3rd Latin American Bitcoin Conference 2015 - Mexico City - $3.808.00

    We are very excited that we were able to secure a speaking opportunity at the highly renowned 3rd Latin American Bitcoin Conference this year. It is taking place in Mexico City and last year the event took place in Rio de Janeiro. Past speakers of this event include Erik Vorhees, Andreas Antonopolus, Tony Gallipi and many others. Please check the details at: www.labitconf.com

    At laBITconf, we will be presenting Dash to business representatives, industry experts and potential end users, and giving an update about Evolution as we prepare for the Miami keynote. We will be sponsoring a booth to exhibit Dash and talk directly to as many people as possible. The cost of this exhibit is $2000.

    Beyond that we (Daniel and I) are requesting that our flights and hotel be refunded as follows:
    • Evans flight cost: $564
    • Daniels flight cost: $644
    • Hotel cost will be approximately $150 a night for each of us, totally $900.
    The North American Bitcoin Conference - BTC Miami - $4160.00

    Another recent announcement was made for our appearance at BTC Miami on January 26th! This is going to be our platform for officially showing a prototype and much more information about work on Dash Evolution.

    The Bitcoin Miami event is the place to be for a new and exciting cryptocurrency project like Dash. When we’re not presenting, we would still like the opportunity to reach out to people and teach them about Dash. To achieve this we are looking into exhibit opportunities at BTC Miami to allow us to reach more people at a cost of between $1500-$2000. Any excess funds will be used as part of the public awareness budget.

    We (Daniel and I) request that our flights and hotel costs be refunded as follows:
    • Evan’s flight cost: $350
    • Daniel’s flight cost: $610
    • Hotel cost will be approximately $200 a night for each of us, totaling $1200
    Amsterdam Bitcoin Wednesday Promotional Costs - $934.00

    When we prepared for the Netherlands presentation, we used some of our own resources to pay for the professional slides and a banner. The presentation slides, templates and icons are reusable, so we’ll use them for the December and January conferences (we’ll have some next slides made as well, but that will be much cheaper).

    Conference materials cost breakdown structure:
    • Dash Banner: 100 EUR
    • Dash PPT presentation template design: 160 EUR
    • Conference slides: 665 EUR (19 slides makeover (at a cost 35 EUR / slide), finally it was 24 slides, including title slide, agenda and transitional slides).
    • Icon set with Finance Industry icons: 22 EUR
    • 2 custom icons design: 10 EUR
    We have negotiated 10% discount to the initial offer (for the package of services and for the non-commercial organization).

    November Budget Summary:

    [​IMG]

    Voting

    To support our new budgets, you can use the following commands:

     
    #1 eduffield, Oct 29, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 29, 2015
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  2. Bridgewater

    Bridgewater Well-known Member
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    Can we vote for the new budgets now or do we have to wait until Nov 1?
     
  3. moocowmoo

    moocowmoo Bovine Bit-flipper
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    #3 moocowmoo, Oct 29, 2015
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  4. TanteStefana

    TanteStefana Moderator
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    Wow, we're spending big time money! But I think it's worth it. You have my support. Just don't get kidnapped in Mexico City! Or eaten by 'gaters! in Miami (JK)
     
    #4 TanteStefana, Oct 29, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 29, 2015
  5. thelazier

    thelazier Active Member

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    Voting with dash-cli

    To support our new budgets, you can use the following commands:
    Code:
    #//laBITconf
    dash-cli mnbudget vote 87a35290fc3178683a171be0fc427d3938a96e61e4b04c7ce19ebd09424bacc1 yes
    #//btc-miami-conf
    dash-cli mnbudget vote f0b16b4e748140a73550c8e169b2fdbc3346b5a3afb7e75d23dce08848c23716 yes
    #//amsterdam-expenses
    dash-cli mnbudget vote 67d24014558a95aafec2296ddf6a8eee299dbcb2212573abc593fb0d702badb8 yes
     
  6. tungfa

    tungfa Administrator
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    voted and loving it :D
     
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  7. the-baker

    the-baker Member

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    ~800 bucks for a makeover of a PPT file seems excessive. Also, I've looked for like five minutes on Airbnb, and they tell me I can get a room in Mexico City for three nights and two people for around 150 total. Are we sure we're really looking for the most cost-effective solutions here?
     
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  8. GermanRed+

    GermanRed+ Active Member

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    I am not against any of these budget items. But, I suddenly think it would be nice and may silence the pre-mine troll if the pre-miners are able to donate to these proposed project account thus reducing the burden of paying from the MN network.

    I do not have a problem with some fraction of DASH pre-mined by the developers. But, if there is a budgeting system to support the development now, it would be nice if some early pre-miners can donate some of their pre-mined DASH to the community. It will silence the pre-mine troll and will probably not hurt them since the price may just not fall as much as we are seeing.

    P.S. I am a late comer and I don't mind the price to fall further so that I can buy more. I may sometimes say negative things/issues but I do not have the intention to troll. I just discuss the issues here because I want to make DASH a better investment. So far, I think the developers are pretty good listeners and I am happy to see how things develop.
     
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  9. GermanRed+

    GermanRed+ Active Member

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    I think it is okay to get a nicer room. They don't go to this kind of conference every month. They are representing the DASH community and it would be embarrassing if we count every cents to be spent in a business trip. So, as long as it is not unreasonably high, they should not seek for the cheapest/er deal.
     
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  10. the-baker

    the-baker Member

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    Well, we had one conference in Oct, one in Dec, one in Jan, so strictly speaking we're almost at one per month. The 150 total figure also was not the cheapest offer you find on AirBnb, the cheapest would be roughly half:

    https://www.airbnb.com/s/Mexico~City--Mexico?guests=2&checkin=04.12.2015&checkout=06.12.2015

    WRT embarrasing: I remember watching this documentary about Ikea where one of the founders said that in the beginning, they always shared one bed when going to conferences (sleeping head to toe). Now that is something I would call penny-pinching, but look where it got them :)

    The point is: This is not some Hip Hop posse that needs to "represent". It's a business trip, and there's nothing wrong with trying to avoid overspending, if you can find better uses for the funds available
     
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  11. GermanRed+

    GermanRed+ Active Member

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    What is the average number of conferences per year? I think it is smaller than 12. Conferences often occur around the same time of the year. I would not go to a conference if I was asked to sleep head to toe but I do agree with you on "avoid overspending" and "find better uses for the funds". It is not cheap but it is not unacceptable yet. They should still listen to you next time.
     
  12. alex-ru

    alex-ru Grizzled Member
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    This part doesn't look effective at all :sad:.

    Please, make additional research - this kind of work can be done several times cheaper, as quick example:
    https://studio.envato.com/search?&utf8=✓&search[query]=presentation&search[max_price]=200

    I also hope that one day we will find voluntaries inside community who could professionally do this part of work for free or with big discount...
     
    #12 alex-ru, Oct 29, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 29, 2015
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  13. tungfa

    tungfa Administrator
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    that was a bit last minute before Amsterdam, last minute is never cheap.
    but we will use these slides (or variations of them) for a long time (all coming presentations / conferences)
     
    #13 tungfa, Oct 29, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 29, 2015
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  14. Minotaur

    Minotaur Well-known Member
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    Hi the-baker, you have some valid questions and that is why this system is good, it keeps things transparent right away. There are some key points that need to be understood, the first and most important one is that we are going to Mexico City. I don't know if you have ever been there, I have, and it is fair to say it is not a safe city. You need to be careful there, stay in good areas and proper hotels. So security is a priority since we all should agree we want to keep Evan safe and that is a determinant factor for us.

    Second and also important, we are paying these things with our credit cards, my bank does not take Dash yet, so all we are hoping for is to at least get refunded in Dash. Dash that we will of course hold, because if we did not want to hold it why go to a conference to talk about it in the first place. Anyone that organizes an event and travels for Dash to make an official presentation should expect the same, to be refunded at least for flight and hotel. What we are not doing is taking Dash to sell it to fund initiatives, no. We are funding initiatives with FIAT and expecting to at least be refunded in Dash, which is a completely different thing.

    I hope this helps clarify.
     
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  15. Minotaur

    Minotaur Well-known Member
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    I think you are letting the trolls get to your head as there are no DASH "pre-mined" by the developers. There was fast mining at the beginning but those coins went to anyone that was there at the time not in particular to Evan who holds a modest amount, to be honest, given his role. None of the people in the team are even miners I have never mined in my life other than with Butterfly Labs ASICS I lost money on.

    So the budget system is necessary and a blessing because it allows to do more for Dash, fund things and actually at least get the coins. The other option would be to ask people to sponsor initiatives that benefit everyone and not even get a refund in coins. We tried that route and it does not work, it is clear that since September more things are starting to happen. Like any business venture, this one carries risk, but at least we did not sit idle to wait for things to magically happen. We are going out there to make things happen, the governance and funding system was a very smart and progressive move. It gives us an actual chance to do things and it gives the opportunity to anyone that wants to help fund things to get the coins back as a thank you.
     
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  16. bluebit

    bluebit Active Member

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    Will supporting the new budgets put downward pressure on the price? We need buyers to put upward pressure on the price to support these budgets...
     
  17. splawik21

    splawik21 Grizzled Member
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    The budgets coins are mainly hold or sold OTC which does not influence the downward preasure.
     
  18. mjsrs

    mjsrs Member

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    Off-topic: where can I find information about OTC trades?
     
  19. splawik21

    splawik21 Grizzled Member
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    Minotaur
     
  20. fulltimegeek

    fulltimegeek Well-known Member
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    Exactly. Too many people in these forums are impatient. Do people here seriously expect a seed to burgeon and produce fruit within a months time? We are still in the process of nurturing and watering the Dash plant. Much fruit will come in due time, if we just continue on the path we're on.
     
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  21. Icebucket

    Icebucket Active Member
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  22. the-baker

    the-baker Member

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    I haven't been to Mexico City yet, but if all goes well, I'll be there in January, so I guess then I can see for myself :)

    But I can make the same Airbnb query for Miami in January: A room for two people/three nights (with ocean view no less..) is listed as 240 total. and that's not the cheapest one, simply the first one in the list. That's 20% of the hotel budget proposed above. I can understand that you don't want people to sleep in shabby youth hostels, and no one is expecting them to do so. But I still find the expenses too high considering the current state of the project/virtual corporation
     
  23. GermanRed+

    GermanRed+ Active Member

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    I once printed a poster outside the hotel and it wasn't cheap at all. If it is the last minute thing, it is very justifiable.
     
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  24. Minotaur

    Minotaur Well-known Member
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    I think you are still missing the point a bit, Dash is not yet an entity that is sending people to travel and paying their expenses. Dash is a project that is asking people to take their credit cards and pay for travel and to take a token in exchange that may be valuable or not in the future.
     
  25. David

    David Well-known Member
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    Agreed. As soon as I saw "held in Mexico City" then the "Why not use airbnb" my immediate thought was "Do you WANT our core developers to get kidnapped???"

    Secondly, with all due respect, F*** the trolls. I'm pretty sure haters gonna hate, no matter what.
     
  26. the-baker

    the-baker Member

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    I get that. People front the money out of their own pocket and are then compensated by stock options (in a manner of speaking). What I'm saying is that this shouldn't be taken as a carte blanche. And I'm not accusing anyone of exploiting their privileges, I'm just pointing out that there are cheaper options that could be taken into consideration. Which means people have to front less money, there's no harm in that as far as I can see
     
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  27. GermanRed+

    GermanRed+ Active Member

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    I once printed a poster outside the hotel and it wasn't cheap at all. If it is the last minute thing, it is very justifiable.
    They did not get into my mind. I just think even if it is "pre-mined", it is not the end of DASH. Look at what other altcoins are doing. The only others that caught my eyes are Ethereum and Ripple. However, the Ripple gateway does not make too much sense after I thought it thorough. The backing of a property is not going to help because you will have to trust that gateway and it also means your gateway created coins has no value because its value is backed by another property. That changes nothing from what we have today: centralization and no control when things get ugly at the gateway. Ethereum looks nice but there is nothing on Ethereum that we cannot have on DASH. (Correct me if I am wrong here.)

    I am totally fine with Evan holding a modest amount. What kind of value does DASH have if even the creator does not want to get a hold of them? If he does not hold DASH, I will not want to hold any DASH. I am just saying that "pre-miners" (just use the troll's term to discuss here) who are not developers and happen to be lucky to mine so many coins at the beginning can contribute some back to the project development. Even a small amount would be a good sign to show how much our DASH community care about the value of DASH.
     
  28. GermanRed+

    GermanRed+ Active Member

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    BTW, I may not be making any sense here today. I was just posting something from my heart which is quite messy these days.
     
  29. GermanRed+

    GermanRed+ Active Member

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    Perhaps, we can have some volunteer to book the hotel and arrange the flight for the guys who are going to the conference. More like acting as a financial officer, accountant and/or secretary.
     
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  30. GermanRed+

    GermanRed+ Active Member

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    My next thought would be "Can we pay the kidnappers ransom in DASH?".
     

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