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DASH naming confusion

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by xjones, Jun 4, 2016.

  1. xjones

    xjones Member

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    Summary: The name "dash" is too generic. It can be retained, but the web presence of dash should be renamed to something unique, such as "dashpay".​

    The name "bitcoin" was not a word until the virtual currency was created.

    The name "ethereum" was not a word until the virtual currency was created. (The currency itself is "ether", a common word, but wisely, they called the system "ethereum" instead.)

    A web search for either "bitcoin" or "ethereum" turns up only bitcoin- and ethereum-related results and almost nothing else.

    The name "dash" is a common English word. A web search for "dash" turns up a lot of results, almost none related to dash the currency. Even if/when dash becomes as well-known as bitcoin, a web search might turn up results related to the virtual currency, but will also turn up many other results relating to other uses of the common English word "dash".

    When Google named its programming language GO, I think they realized that there would be confusion with other meanings of the word "go". They called their website "golang.com", and in all references to the programming language go they always mention "golang" so we know what to search for. A search for "golang" only turns up results relating to the programming language and nothing else -- because golang is not an English word.

    I think it was a strategic error to use a common English word to name dash the virtual currency.

    But this error could be fixed, by picking a different word for web references. Just like Google chose "golang", dash can use some other word, like: "Dashpay, the virtual currency payment system that uses dash the virtual currency". Then all web searches would be for dashpay, not dash. Already, I see that Google gives a lot of dash-related hits for "dashpay".

    I think virtual currency exchanges should be asked to list dash as "dashpay". The official website should be dashpay.org, dashpay.com, dashpay.io, dashpay.<something>. Press releases should prominently mention "dashpay" as the name of the system, and then also tell the reader that the currency itself is called "dash".

    All official documents should frequently mention "dashpay" as the name of the system, and then clarify that the currency itself is called dash.

    Look at the confusion:

    https://www.dash.org/forum/threads/fxopen-forex-is-now-trading-dash-but-confused-with-dashcoin.9084/

    They would have called it DASHPAY but nobody asked them. So they called it DASHCOIN instead.
     
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  2. tungfa

    tungfa Administrator
    Dash Core Team Foundation Member Masternode Owner/Operator Moderator

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    yup
    to some degree you are 'unfortunately' right :rolleyes:
    but Dash is Dash and no renaming will be considered (as we changed 3 times in 2,5 years already)
    we gotta make the best out of what we have ;) for now
     
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  3. xjones

    xjones Member

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    I hope you see that I wasn't suggesting renaming the virtual currency itself.

    Does the reluctance to change to a unique web identity (like "dashpay" instead of "dash") come from the fact that names have been already changed in the past? Or is there any other reason?

    Is that the general consensus among the primary movers of the project, or are there varying opinions?
     
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  4. rustycase

    rustycase Active Member

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    Since I do not have a handy stylized D on my keyboard, I think it should always be referred to as DASH, in all caps.
    This would differentiate this special Cryptocoin from simple use of the action verb, dash.
    rc
     
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  5. koampapapa

    koampapapa New Member

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    I agree with dashpay
     
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  6. AndyDark

    AndyDark Well-known Member

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    i think Dash is fine for the currency, there is nothing really big using this name yet. In Evolution a lot of what we are doing for consumer services is called DashPay. Dash = the currency, DashPay = the end-user services where you can spend Dash
     
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  7. UdjinM6

    UdjinM6 Official Dash Dev
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    We "simply" have to make all other Dash meanings to be insignificant comparing to Dash as a currency. Easy :D

    Btw Apple is a generic word too :rolleyes:
     
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  8. AndyDark

    AndyDark Well-known Member

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    Precisely :) Too early to be concerned too much about web rankings / brand recognition / SEO when we don't have a web enabled product yet (neither does any cryptocurrency). I think Dash is a great name for the currency and has massive brand potential once we give online user's something they can actually use like any other online service.
     
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  9. TaoOfSatoshi

    TaoOfSatoshi Grizzled Member

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    I'm sure Steve Jobs and Tim Cook spent many nights in the garage wondering:
    "When is our website going to outperform that f*cking fruit?"
    :p
    I'm sure we'll be fine with DASH if we are successful...
     
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  10. rustycase

    rustycase Active Member

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    'if' ???

    Don't know abt u, but I shall prevail.

    I have yet to notice anything about DASH that is not substantial, robust, presents an image of integrity, security, and efficiency, etc.
    ( a reduction in mining payouts is disconcerting to me )

    Growth exists and exchange market presence is small, yet increasing... A good sign, in my view ! perhaps a sign it has not been falsely injected with and artificial boost. Growth in substance is a good thing !

    I appreciate the dev team's work the more I read about it.

    Build it and they will come.

    Best
    rc

    edit: I have no skill or ability in market trading, yet have read page after page in hopes of learning.
    Did my recent acquistion of crypto serve to support present market value, or did it show lack of faith in fiat shenanigans ?
    I would like to think, both.
    The exchange watch sites show Poloniex, one of the few places where one can purchase DASH, has most of it's DASH trading comming from the btc crowd, and only a very small margin coming from fiat sources.
    As ED has declared work is in progress on ramping up fiat access, the indication from Poloniex shows experienced crypto users/traders are moving to DASH, yet the fiat using public has not yet become impressed with the value and utility of DASH.

    ...and it's Not that I do not see a valid position for CC companies and Paypal... Presently, I have initiated a case against a vendor who did not ship a product I paid for. I hope to recover.
    Such is not possible with P2P without making use of an escrow service, AFAIK.
    rc


    .
     
    #10 rustycase, Jun 4, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2016
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  11. xjones

    xjones Member

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    Let's review all the comments so far.

    Comparisons with Apple

    All these comparisons are totally off the mark. When Apple Computer Inc. (not just "Apple" -- the name change to "Apple Inc." didn't come until 25 years later) started in the seventies, there was no Internet. Their publicity efforts focused on printed magazines. Had they wanted to advertise primarily in magazines about fruit, I'm sure they would not have picked Apple Computer as a name. But in the technical world, there was no other Apple Computer, or even just Apple. Apple Records Inc. was a record company making vinyl records; completely unrelated to computers. Since there was no Google and no Internet anyway, there was no need to worry about what a web search would show up.

    Even Apple, however, brands its primary products with unique names today, so you don't find the wrong thing in a web search. Consider: iMac; iPod; iPhone.

    Smart companies choose unique names such that they can pick a Twitter handle and a domain matching their name, and they try to pick something that can be easily found in a web search.

    General praise of Dash

    This is off the mark because it focuses on what Dash fans think and ignores the general public and mainstream publications. Dash fans, especially those wanting to run masternodes and get the weekly payments, are obviously going to value Dash and drive up its price.

    We cannot be sure that this is not just a bubble driven by a feedback loop due to demand from people wanting to run masternodes.
    It's hard to recognize a bubble until after it bursts.

    A virtual currency does not succeed until some combination of the following occurs: 1. Vendors begin accepting it as payment; 2. The general public begins to value it; 3. Mainstream publications (WSJ, Economist, Reuters, NYT) begin to write about it.

    I'm not saying that we should expect all this to happen immediately, but at least let's not get overconfident and just assume it will happen.

    We don't need to worry about brand recognition or SEO

    Maybe we don't. But we cannot be sure of that. Whatever the growth of Dash is in the next couple of years, if improving its name recognition (and avoiding confusion) helps even x%, where x is some small number, that x% will give us the factor (1 + x) ** N in N years. This is called compounding, as you all know. Why should we give up that increment, which increases exponentially?

    I think some of you have fallen prey to the sunk cost fallacy.
     
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  12. tuapoma

    tuapoma Member

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    hello xjones, you are right in your opinion, your thesis is very consistent. I also thought about it when I read the name "dash" for the first time. The DASH developers has to consider and analyze this thread.

    However, in my opinion the name DASH is very good, it reminds CASH and is easily connected to the idea "digital cash". But the name "Darkcoin" is better; well, we have to realize that the name "Darkcoin" will never be forgotten. The name darkcoin should not be abandoned, it would be good to keep both names, Darkcoin and DASH or else, DASH as a nickname for Darkcoin.
     
  13. TaoOfSatoshi

    TaoOfSatoshi Grizzled Member

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    I have to agree with @UdjinM6. We had a long, drawn out debate over whether or not to accept Oblox's Dash idea. It was brought forward that a company or product's brand should be representative of them, and we agreed that Dash, which represents "Digital Cash", was perfect. Just because we have a generic name, doesn't mean we can't make it dominate over the other Dash terms over time. We are already on the first page of Google, and if we end up doing what we intend to do, which is to be a worldwide currency, the name will be commonplace. We will dominate searches due to the sheer amount of people who use or want to learn about it. I will vote against any move to revisit branding. Dash is fine.
     
  14. Dunedoo

    Dunedoo Well-known Member
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    Dash Address:
    XyoSz4xviVGfks1pLhaXw2Baqmhfw5k7MG
    I tried to talk to a few people about Dash in a very basic way and the feedback I got was this apart of the Kardashians.
    upload_2016-6-6_18-26-14.png
    I'll provide links next time
     
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  15. xjones

    xjones Member

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    There's a proposal being voted on right now to change the YouTube channel for Dash to youtube.com/dashorg.

    I think they could have made it youtube.com/dashpay and maintained some consistency.
     
  16. TechWoman92

    TechWoman92 New Member

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    Dashpay is a good name. Just use that
     
  17. TreasureSeeker

    TreasureSeeker New Member

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    Although better than just Dash, Dashpay is also used by at least 2 other companies. Dash is better than the old name of Darkcoin but awful when it comes to anything else. Tell someone abut Bitcoin, they'll search for it and find it. Tell someone about Dash, they'll search for it and give up. People seeing sites that accept Dash may go searching for what this is and get completely confused.

    And please, no more of this "yes but Dash will rise to the top of search results eventually". Search engines algorithms will do what they like, and Dash may never get to the top.

    A unique brandable name is vital in these days of Internet searching. The name Dash is a big drawback to greater adoption.

    When I first heard about Bitcoin I was easily able to search for it and find out what it's about. This is not the case with Dash.
     
  18. TaoOfSatoshi

    TaoOfSatoshi Grizzled Member

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    Ironically, though some people like to criticize the "Dash Nation" community-building concept, it is a way better term in regards to SEO. If you Google that, you already get tons of Dash info. If we could somehow incorporate that into the official channels through a Dash Nation page on Dash.org, we could completely take over that search result. We could use a slogan like this "Join Dash Nation. Enjoy digital cash." and then promote it with links to Dash.org or other dash related sites. But for that to happen the team would have to be willing to make that concept official, and I'm not sure they're willing to do that.

    No matter, I will keep bringing people in using that concept, so all is not lost...
     
  19. TheDashGuy

    TheDashGuy Well-known Member

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    Bitcoins name at first had the same issue, although it IS unique. It's not obvious as to what they do and its gimmicky. you tell someone dash is just Digital Cash w/ a better name, they get it.
     
  20. TreasureSeeker

    TreasureSeeker New Member

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    Great idea, Tao. I like the whole concept you're building around Dash Nation too.
     
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  21. TheDashGuy

    TheDashGuy Well-known Member

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    Bitcoins name at first had the same issue, although it IS unique. It's not obvious as to what they do and its gimmicky. you tell someone dash is just Digital Cash w/ a better name, they get it.
     
  22. TaoOfSatoshi

    TaoOfSatoshi Grizzled Member

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    Thank you for your kind words. I'm seeing lots of positive reception to the initiative in general. We are going to take it to the next level through the website and other initiatives anyway, so it would be great to have the team's cooperation as well!
     
  23. tuapoma

    tuapoma Member

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    Tao, it's the way, the Dash team needs to promote related websites with links to Dash.org, we need to come together, we be many and they are few :rolleyes: they need us more than we need them :cool: A joint action is the best way to highlight this unique brand. :eek:DASHo_O We need share Dash websites, share more and more... the dash nation is a great idea, you already have my support, shares, and more shares across my social media platforms... We Are Dash Nation!
    best
     
    #23 tuapoma, Jun 13, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2016
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  24. TaoOfSatoshi

    TaoOfSatoshi Grizzled Member

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    Gracias, amigo!
     
  25. xjones

    xjones Member

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    If there's enough possibility of confusion between "dashpay" and other prior uses of the same word, by all means let's find some other word.

    I can think of replacements for "dashpay" but I won't point them out here. Unethical people might grab the corresponding domain names, twitter handles, youtube channels, etc., in anticipation of selling them back to the Dash organization.

    Any choice of a new name should be made by the appropriate dash developers quietly, and they should grab the domains, handles, channels, etc., before they announce any new name. And then they can announce their choice and look for feedback and rethink their choice if necessary.
     
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  26. tuapoma

    tuapoma Member

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    We need share websites with links to dash.org, we need to come together. A joint action is the best way to highlight the brand | DASH | as the best cryptocurrency.

    please take the initiative to create pages on social networks such as facebook, G+, twitter..., if possibel, make a blogger or a wordpress blog to post news and videos on youtube, post vimeo and others... share more and more the best pages related to DASH cryptocurrency.

    Lets start now! I want follow you, please follow me too:
    https://twitter.com/@tuapoma
    and
    https://www.facebook.com/tuapoma-305735902786545/
    cheers
     
    #26 tuapoma, Jun 28, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2016
  27. aka5

    aka5 Active Member
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    For real? Mr. xjones, i personally dislike you and your posts ... it's just me so you don't have to care ... but like i said in your last post with the title "How masternode payments might cause a bubble" - i'm pretty sure you are playing all these "cards" to get a down momentum in price after the break of 0.01 didn't has gone enough momentum to the downside - yes it's pure speculation but my guess is you are in a short right now, and you are trying to save your ass with topics like these!
     
  28. David

    David Well-known Member
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    Actually, back in January 2014 when the idea of Ethereum was first being floated, any web search for "Ethereum" brought up tons of World of Warcraft links =)
     
  29. Bugeater

    Bugeater Member

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    Bitcoin, Ethereum, Litecoin, Dogecoin, Monero, Factom, and Lisk. All excellent names that were made up from the start. Original poster is 100% correct.

    Dash founder is a tech guy and NOT a promoter or advertiser. I've seen youtube videos and he is describing amazing ideas that I love and even I am being put to sleep. We need a guy with orange hair that is beyond motivated to promote DASH and find us a better name. Time to split up developer and advertisement.