Ben Swan wants a free lunch and give no account of funds. Lets fund these 5 projects instead.

Do you think we should start every month with 2000/6100 dash by giving our money beforehand?

  • Yes

    Votes: 2 50.0%
  • No

    Votes: 2 50.0%

  • Total voters
    4

Argon31

Member
Mar 10, 2018
214
54
88
37
The treasury is being utilized very poorly. Most of the money is being given to vested interests and nepotism has reached a peak.

Over the next few months from the 6176 available, the following money has already been committed

1200 core (If not more)
800 swann
1000 Strike Social
500 Feedbands

with a few crumbs available for other projects.

Strike social is getting 3 proposals worth 1000 Dash passed in a single month and proposals asking for 41 dash, 50 dash are the ones getting kicked around. We are spending 1000 dash on youtube ads without any idea of results except some vanity metrics.

@ec1warc1 is responsible for 20% of all of dash's transactions with a few dash but he is being given a hard time for 44 dash.. Dashacademy has been for 2 months, just so they can start working on training material. captahab has had a full months payment docked because the money was given to some other big guy.

This largesse is killing innovation in the treasury big time and these huge spends are leaving no budget is left for anything else.

I appeal to the community to properly investigate every multi month proposal above 200 or 250 dash and be far more stringent on these people rather than the smaller innovators..
 

Andres Larez

Member
Feb 18, 2018
50
49
58
26
Dash Address
XhsCuYrkWRjyFtscCvrFE91nEC2kNuvD9v
Hello! I have been following your post. And you are very consistent with what you want to convey, I hope you are interpreting how it should be. You are absolutely right WHERE IS THE RESULT OF SO MANY DASH SPENDED?

We must self-demand results, true technological development or real adoption.

We have the case of conferences and different meetups. These cost us relatively little, and have attracted a giant community of enthusiastic Dash entrepreneurs.

Now our duty is to continue with the great work of adoption that all our colleagues in the community have shown. And take it to the next level. TRUE TECHNOLOGICAL POWER BASED ON DECENTRALIZATION
 

TroyDASH

Well-known Member
Jul 31, 2015
1,251
794
183
For what it's worth, one or two of the strikesocial proposals might not pass (the latest one for +500 is the least likely to be funded, and one of the other ones is just barely passing and might still be bumped out by other things).

I support the Ben Swann proposal but that one isn't a shoe-in yet either.

And I'm not sure why you are lumping in the core proposals with these, is just to increase the total to make it seem worse? Obviously you object to Ben and StrikeSocial, but do you object to funding the core salaries?
 

Argon31

Member
Mar 10, 2018
214
54
88
37
@TroyDASH

I support Core Salaries and whatever conferences they think are important without a doubt but none of their marketing stuff.
That was really abysmal.

I do not support committing such a large amount of future funds to bloated proposals that lack serious ROI.
Committing 800 for four months to swann will substantially diminish the scope for other good projects in the works for the next three months.

We should not give more than 150X3 or 4(whatever that is worth in any month) to anyone, unless it really is a special case.
Even much as i like dashmaximalists project, I think asking for 550 more on top of 150 was crazy.

I think Law of diminishing returns applies fast after that amount. Proposal owners should be scrappy and not behave like silicon valley/ wall st execs.

I dont think we should be blowing 500 dash on random advertising without an actual use case with feedbands. Waste of money.
Ditto for Ben Swann and Strike Social. I can see just one or two good use case projects. There is a good remittances one for 30-35 posted recently and dashacademy.
We need to fund and encourage these kinds.

I would still have voted for Swann as a special case (upto 300X3) if he was forthcoming and transparent and showed us the returns but he is using us like a teller machine.
For anyone who understands this medium, 5000 random clicks is a laughable return. I know you dont agree with me.

Some people have requested him for a simple breakup which he has ignored. Big Red flag for me.
It angers me a touch that 300+ votes have been cast for him without even a break up for the current and previous amounts.
This is an insult to every sincere proposal owner.

I think it should be mandatory down to the last dash and certainly for 800X4. The deliverables should be equal to more ten times of a 100X4 proposal to make sense.
It is not the case here.

I the current scenario, we are going to begin the next month with 4000 committed(including core), and other 400X3's trying to swallow up the budget, leaving nothing for fresh innovation.

This is my problem with Swann and the way we are dealing the treasury.
I am not sure if the others see my point.
 
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feedbands

Active Member
Dec 2, 2017
309
172
113
35
Just want to jump in here and show everyone the ROI transparency dashboard Feedbands has been working on that will allow you to track every dollar of our ad spend, every click, and every goal / conversion from our campaign.

roi.dashinformer.com

Please note:

  • We're still tweaking it, and not all the data is piping in yet.
  • There are tabs and pagination at the bottom left, 7 pages of dashboard total.
  • In a few more days it should be ready & accurately reporting.
  • There is a 12 to 24 hour lag on the fetching of some data.

Bottom left of page two is particularly informative as it shows you a complete goal breakdown by type of goal (wallet, exchange, proposals, social) When we prove our spend to core this month they will be able to confirm all the data are correct.

While we realize we have requested significant funding over several months, we are also focused on creating a model for transparency and granular ROI reporting.
 
Last edited:
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Argon31

Member
Mar 10, 2018
214
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Feedbands, I have observed you are always trying to cook up schemes to waste the treasury money.

You execution is great, no doubt, but your general ideas have no merit.

What is the point of showing ads to people who have no use for dash? There is no use case..

You can keep going on and on about random metrics but the bottomline is, you are showing ads to people who dont need dash.

All the merchant adoption etc is just hogwash. No one is becoming a user..

Anyway, keep on dazzling people with fancy words like granular reporting, data piping..
Your work has the least roi of them all..

They dont impress me.
 
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feedbands

Active Member
Dec 2, 2017
309
172
113
35
I respect your viewpoint and your concerns. If I may respectfully address your points one at a time:

1. Regarding the ads that we show to people. On google, our greatest push towards merchants has been to show ads to people searching specifically for "how to accept bitcoin" and "how to accept cryptocurrency". These are merchants, e-commerce or otherwise, who are already searching for an integration solution to accept cryptocurrency for their ecommerce or brick and mortar location. We have a solution that works today which allows folks to accept any cryptocurrency and settle in Dash. We are pushing hard to appear on these searches because these merchants are endeavoring today to integrate cryptocurrency payments for their business. Dash can either be a part of that, or not. We would rather Dash is a part of it. Given Google's ban, we only have precious few months left anyway to appear on these searches.

2. Regarding merchants, and users, our most recent event the Feedbands Dashfest in Austin, Texas had between one to two thousand people download the dash wallet, get some dash, and use it for the first time. There were lines out the door and around the block for people to transact in Dash all day long. In addition, we have pushed hard for the venue, Cenote, to accept Dash day to day. This has lead to talks between Dash Core and their POS provider Toast to integrate. Those discussions are ongoing.

3. Finally, I would like to address mindshare. Right now, if Jack Dorsey and Charlie Lee team up on a project to make Bitcoin transfers instantly and for less than a penny, and they're getting all the press, then we have a serious problem. I feel, unequivocally, that we need to let the world know now that Dash already does this. Dash already can make instant payments. Dash can already make payments for less than a penny. The problem is, everyone in the Dash community already knows this, and everyone not in the Dash community doesn't know this. So yes, we do feel a full page New York Times ad letting people know this is a prudent course of action.

I don't expect everyone to agree with our perspectives, mission or objectives, and I respect your right to disagree. They do, however, come absolutely from a place of wanting what is best for Dash.
 

ayo_brezzy

New Member
Feb 28, 2018
22
14
3
38
In the next few months there will be an effort in collecting data to analyze the ROI on proposals of the past that will help how the MNOs vote in the present and future. @ayo_brezzy Is working to that end. Please check out her pre-proposal here:

https://www.dash.org/forum/threads/proposal-dash-network-business-development.31980/
Thanks for mentioning it! I think in the periods to come, (especially with the 2000 Dash outlay pre month-end) having projects that are present to aid existing efforts will be crucial. I believe that we all want to see Dash be successfyl, but we have to figure out a way to maintain the energy of decentralization, while growing with the returns of a cohesive plan and unified focus.
 

ayo_brezzy

New Member
Feb 28, 2018
22
14
3
38
For what it's worth, one or two of the strikesocial proposals might not pass (the latest one for +500 is the least likely to be funded, and one of the other ones is just barely passing and might still be bumped out by other things).

I support the Ben Swann proposal but that one isn't a shoe-in yet either.

And I'm not sure why you are lumping in the core proposals with these, is just to increase the total to make it seem worse? Obviously you object to Ben and StrikeSocial, but do you object to funding the core salaries?
@TroyDASH

I support Core Salaries and whatever conferences they think are important without a doubt but none of their marketing stuff.
That was really abysmal.

I do not support committing such a large amount of future funds to bloated proposals that lack serious ROI.
Committing 800 for four months to swann will substantially diminish the scope for other good projects in the works for the next three months.

We should not give more than 150X3 or 4(whatever that is worth in any month) to anyone, unless it really is a special case.
Even much as i like dashmaximalists project, I think asking for 550 more on top of 150 was crazy.

I think Law of diminishing returns applies fast after that amount. Proposal owners should be scrappy and not behave like silicon valley/ wall st execs.

I dont think we should be blowing 500 dash on random advertising without an actual use case with feedbands. Waste of money.
Ditto for Ben Swann and Strike Social. I can see just one or two good use case projects. There is a good remittances one for 30-35 posted recently and dashacademy.
We need to fund and encourage these kinds.

I would still have voted for Swann as a special case (upto 300X3) if he was forthcoming and transparent and showed us the returns but he is using us like a teller machine.
For anyone who understands this medium, 5000 random clicks is a laughable return. I know you dont agree with me.

Some people have requested him for a simple breakup which he has ignored. Big Red flag for me.
It angers me a touch that 300+ votes have been cast for him without even a break up for the current and previous amounts.
This is an insult to every sincere proposal owner.

I think it should be mandatory down to the last dash and certainly for 800X4. The deliverables should be equal to more ten times of a 100X4 proposal to make sense.
It is not the case here.

I the current scenario, we are going to begin the next month with 4000 committed(including core), and other 400X3's trying to swallow up the budget, leaving nothing for fresh innovation.

This is my problem with Swann and the way we are dealing the treasury.
I am not sure if the others see my point.
I mirror your concern 100%.... but without a method to review data, we are blind here.

Not to be self promoting on a discussion, but I was interested in starting a campaign for DASH targeting the African American community. In the process of trying to isolate my own value added indicators, I was disappointed that there was nothing readily available to review not just past or fail proposals (popularity still rules, even at DASH *nerd tears*), but also, what factors guarantee my successful deliverable of 1 thing - increasing regular transaction volume for DASH.

Ideally, the answer is not to stop doing what we are doing, but to find and maximize the indicators that can be traced and raised. Where we are now, we have no idea what we are getting, and no way duplicate the positive returns without a blind payment.

I'm including the link to my proposal, I'd love your feedback. In all honesty, I need to see that the community values my abilities and my insight before I invest my money..... As should the DASH Treasury. *wink*

https://www.dash.org/forum/threads/proposal-dash-network-business-development.31980/#post-175024
 
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demo

Well-known Member
Apr 23, 2016
3,114
263
153
Dash Address
XnpT2YQaYpyh7F9twM6EtDMn1TCDCEEgNX
@TroyDASH

I support Core Salaries and whatever conferences they think are important without a doubt but none of their marketing stuff.
That was really abysmal.

I do not support committing such a large amount of future funds to bloated proposals that lack serious ROI.
Committing 800 for four months to swann will substantially diminish the scope for other good projects in the works for the next three months.

We should not give more than 150X3 or 4(whatever that is worth in any month) to anyone, unless it really is a special case.
Even much as i like dashmaximalists project, I think asking for 550 more on top of 150 was crazy.

I think Law of diminishing returns applies fast after that amount. Proposal owners should be scrappy and not behave like silicon valley/ wall st execs.

I dont think we should be blowing 500 dash on random advertising without an actual use case with feedbands. Waste of money.
Ditto for Ben Swann and Strike Social. I can see just one or two good use case projects. There is a good remittances one for 30-35 posted recently and dashacademy.
We need to fund and encourage these kinds.

I would still have voted for Swann as a special case (upto 300X3) if he was forthcoming and transparent and showed us the returns but he is using us like a teller machine.
For anyone who understands this medium, 5000 random clicks is a laughable return. I know you dont agree with me.

Some people have requested him for a simple breakup which he has ignored. Big Red flag for me.
It angers me a touch that 300+ votes have been cast for him without even a break up for the current and previous amounts.
This is an insult to every sincere proposal owner.

I think it should be mandatory down to the last dash and certainly for 800X4. The deliverables should be equal to more ten times of a 100X4 proposal to make sense.
It is not the case here.

I the current scenario, we are going to begin the next month with 4000 committed(including core), and other 400X3's trying to swallow up the budget, leaving nothing for fresh innovation.

This is my problem with Swann and the way we are dealing the treasury.
I am not sure if the others see my point.
Vote the numbers.
Vote the numbers.
Vote the numbers.
VOTE THE NUMBERS!
VOTE THE NUMBERS!

VOTE THE NUMBERS!
VOTE THEM WITH SLIDERS!!!!!

The question "how much the politicians should be paid." is not a correct question. The correct question is "how much the politicians should be paid, as a percentage of the total budget, and what are the percentages you vote for other government expenditures?" . The citizents must have a clear view that the more they pay for a government expenditure the less remains for the rest government expenditures. And this cannot be seen when you ask them separate questions for each expenditure. You have to ask them for all the expenditures together, and with the help of sliders similar to the below.



 
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Argon31

Member
Mar 10, 2018
214
54
88
37
We can fund 5 these projects if Ben Swann is voted down.

IN ADDITION, WE WILL BE ABLE TO FUND ANOTHER 15 such projects in the next 3 months

Project Two Million - Nigeria Mass Adoption - Dash Squard2018-04-18 04:46:14
(Details | Comments [29]) Dash-Africa-Escrow 1/1 268 107 1 161 3.4% 95.52
($42,650.64) 6,256.92
Graph
Building a Dashy Africa - Phase 1 2018-04-18 05:50:37
(Details | Comments [7]) lnstantKarmaFund 1/1 244 117 19 127 2.7% 182.00
($81,264.82) 6,438.92
Graph
FREEDOM! Book Sponsorship (Adam Kokesh) 2018-06-16 23:48:08
(Details | Comments [11]) rion 1/3 217 90 13 127 2.7% 25.00
($11,162.75) 6,463.92
Graph
Dash Starter Kit - Philippines 2018-04-18 03:42:15
(Details | Comments [17]) 12god 1/1 225 118 25 107 2.2% 122.00
($54,474.22) 6,585.92
Graph
Video with Danny Trejo to Promote Dash on Social Platforms - Fast April Turnaround 2018-04-18 07:26:43
(Details | Comments [38]) nrpetty 1/1 253 151 19 102 2.1% 427.00
($190,659.77) 7,012.92
Graph

@TroyDASH @Name3 @Dashmaximalist @QuantumExplorer @Nuancer


LETS DO THIS!
 

QuantumExplorer

Active Member
Core Developer
Aug 20, 2014
126
161
93
Not sure why I'm pinged here, you don't need to convince me. I don't like the Ben Swann proposal at all mostly because he isn't accountable to anyone, hasn't answered my question on how much money he is earning, eats 13% of our budget doesn't pull it's fair weight. Also if it were up to me I would ask all the marketing proposals to just stop and stockpile cash for evolution launch, however I know that people like feedbands really do care about Dash so they might be better suited at gaging marketing than me as a dev/researcher.

Very often I vote based on who I perceive the winner of the proposal to be, if I think the biggest winner is the owner if it passes I vote no, if I think the biggest winner is the dash network if it passes I vote yes.
 

demo

Well-known Member
Apr 23, 2016
3,114
263
153
Dash Address
XnpT2YQaYpyh7F9twM6EtDMn1TCDCEEgNX
@TanteStefana said:
https://www.dashcentral.org/p/project2million
An open letter to Masternode Owners

I’m writing to you and the community as a whole. I understand that many of you bought into Dash because you see it as a potential winner in the crypto space and that you can earn a steady income from running a node. The budget system is great, only as a business person, you don’t see the value of some of the apparently wasteful things that have been supported in the past, and you are going to do your darndest to put a stop to it! I appreciate that. Many of the things Dash has done don’t make economic sense. I keep hearing about the Rate of Income, and that we’re not seeing sufficient returns on some of the proposals. Unfortunately, I don’t think you understand what you signed on for. Please let me explain.

The cryptocurrency movement started by the unknown Satoshi Nakamoto, is a declaration of war against the incumbent banking system. There is no sweeter way of saying it. Of course nobody wants actual war, or any type of violence, however the incumbent system has utterly failed the people of the world in so many ways, and are undoubtedly the cause and source of all the wars around the world; the proof of which would be far too long a book to write here. This war can only be won Gandhi style, Martin Luther King Jr. style. We must win the hearts and minds of the world. We must grab as big a foothold in countries who have been decimated by bad governments and bankers. What you signed on for here is not a “business” that runs a balance sheet and must show profit. You signed on to a war.

If you have not noticed yet, The IMF’s Christine Lagarde had declared the need to “control cryptocurrencies”. The good news is that they can not, ultimately, control them. They can however block fiat access which would be a huge slowdown in adoption. You see, when Satoshi Nakamoto launched Bitcoin, he knew he already won the war. However, there are still battles to go through. They will not change the ultimate outcome, but they can cause a LOT of misery; probably even death, as it’s obvious that those in power will do anything to keep it. It does NOT have to go this way if we play the game of Chess well. They’re on the defense. Lets keep them there!

So what do we need to get us through these battles as unscathed and solid as possible? We need two things. We need to win hearts and minds of the people of the world and we need to get footholds in large areas where people use cryptos in daily life, not fiat. For this, Dash is the best tool, but the crypto community as a whole needs to band together to make this work! And because of our budget, Dash is in the best position to lead this charge.

If you have not noticed, the media is fully controlled by the governments today. There is no more freedom of the press anymore, except for small independent groups and individuals. Today’s mainstream media is pulled by the very same strings; not left, not right, none of that is even real. Who in America that isn’t brainwashed or mentally ill, really hates blacks, whites, browns yellows and purples? You really think “white” people care what color skin another person has? I’ll tell you, not any more than a black or brown or purple person is likely to hate a white or other color person. No, it’s a tool to divide and conquer. Birth control, abortion, wages, race; it’s all fodder to keep the people incensed and impudent. Nothing changes no matter who is in charge.

By supporting projects like The Free Thought Project, Ben Swann, and the crypto show (and their humanitarian aid arm) and more, we develop a relationship and allies. Our funding can empower free media, and in return we can expect that they will tell the truth about crypto. This is the absolutely best way to win hearts and minds in my opinion because even the most average of humans in the United States feels manipulated and that something isn’t right in the media, even if they can’t put their finger on it. If we can increase the reach of Truth in Media or any other such project, it will be the best tool we can hope for in this war.

Also, the importance of what we do in Venezuela and other South American countries, plus what we do for many countries in Africa cannot be under estimated. These are Dash’s and crypto’s foot holds. There is so much potential in Africa and South America, and digital currencies will free that potential. If you don’t know by now, you should know that it is corrupt banking or lack thereof that keeps the people in these parts of the world from participating economically in the world. If we get a real economy working in these parts of the world, these countries or areas have no debt, no love of western banking. They will be whole heartedly crypto. And nobody will be able to change that.

Either we win, or we drag this out forever, until the corrupt institutions of the world find a way to co-opt everything the crypto community have been trying to build. We look at the bottom line for what Ben Swann’s rate of return cost per click was, or we back media because it represents freedom as does cryptocurrency. We build a trust relationship with hard working young people in Africa, who are grass rooting their country and soon catapulting it to the top of the food chain, or we leave them and their potential high and dry because pictures aren’t enough proof, there “could” be waste in how they are functioning, or god forbit they “take us” for a dash or two. I don’t even think they’d ever even do that, they’re full of so much zest for building an economy in their homeland, but the narrow-minded fear we seem to have is starting to become irrational.

If you haven’t guessed by now, this letter to you, the Dash community is a request to support and vote for all the African, Venezuelan, Benn Swann, Truth in Media proposals because we NEED these people to win! Thank you so much for reading this and I apologize for posting this everywhere, but that is my intention.
The mastress @TanteStefana wishes peace among proposals, but she ignores/refuses to vote the numbers.
The pie is one and must be shared, you can't have the pie and eat it too!
 
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TaoOfSatoshi

Grizzled Member
Jul 15, 2014
2,797
2,614
1,183
Dash Nation
www.dashnation.com

TaoOfSatoshi

Grizzled Member
Jul 15, 2014
2,797
2,614
1,183
Dash Nation
www.dashnation.com
Tante's "open letter to Masternode Owners" (wherein she demonstrates unfamiliarity with the concept of ROI) is not a factual essay but rather an op-ed essay of creative writing and (dare I call it) speculation.

How can anyone respond to pure opinion regarding future events with anything other than more speculative opinion? I do endeavor to leaven my supposition with facts and am sorry to disappoint...


I wouldn't mind at all framing my response to Tante's manifesto with a 'this is all just IMO and not necessarily fact' disclaimer.

But that seems a bit ridiculous. Are you sure you're not just white knighting for Tante by misapplying a well-intended rule to censor criticism and debate?
How can I learn how to follow the rules if you don't explain which parts of my posts violated them and offer advice on how to improve?

Please consider restoring my post and allowing me the privilege of editing out 100% of any potentially problematic Speculation Assertion.
Thanks in advance.
I’m not commenting on past posts, as I was not in this position before. My team and I are only responsible for posts and threads posted from this point on, and that’s what we will be focused on. Everybody starts at 0.