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Dash Core Group Q4 2017 Summary Call

This is to inform about the Dash Core Group Inc. quarterly call to present project progress made during Q4 2017, summarise Core Team activities and answer your questions.

The call takes place on Friday, 9th of February at 15:00 UTC. The call will be recorded and shared on the Dash Youtube channel.

Agenda:
  1. Welcome and Introduction
  2. Software Development Update
  3. Business Development Update
  4. Marketing and Communication Update
  5. Project Organization Update
  6. Project Finance Update
  7. Summary and Comments
  8. Q&A


Link:
 
Sorry @Stealth923 , but I think we have completely different goals and vision of the project.
You are interested in gains and position on the Coinmarketcap.com. We are interested in the development of the best payments platform based on the Dash blockchain. We have never committed to any price levels or positions in statistics/charts.

Incorrect, I don’t care about price - I am using coin market cap rank as a sentiment indicator of how our project is doing relative to other projects which provide proper updates and communication. Investors are starting to realize Dash core has not shown any substantial evidence that Evolution has made any progress from years ago.

Gaining trust and confidence of investors is an important piece to success. You of all people, as a PM should understand managing the expectations of a client and the importance of effective communication on a projects work in progress. The community has given core ample time (2 Years) to work on Evolution effectively with all budgets passed with little to no questions or proof of work. When would you say is a good time for the community to start asking for evidence? Another few years? The communication coordinator promised over 6 months ago still has not been provided. @Ryan Taylor. Some help here would be good.
 
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@Stealth923 - I think I understood pretty well. I also understand that we will never satisfy all of the people, even communicating 24/7.
We work on the improvements in the communication process and also development. This is what I am able to communicate.
 
@kot You are working on communication improvements for almost a year now and for Evo backend for 2 years already. In both cases looks like there is no progress at all. Project portfolio reports that you provide each month are pretty useless if we don't see time frames for each part of development. After 2 years the community is fed up with responses like "will be ready when it is ready" and "we're working on it" and requires much better updates from Core Team
 
I agree, we need more information on development process. I am holding pretty big investment as dozen MNs and, of course, i hope for good but already passed a lot of time but still can not see any progress.
 
Perspective of the top 11 on CMC:
  • Bitcoin and Litecoin are brothers, using old tech, blockchain 1.0

  • Bitcoin Cash and Dash are sisters, both forward looking and open to change, though Dash is superior for having an ongoing budget

  • Ethereum, Neo, Cardano, NEM and EOS are smart contracting systems whose main purpose is not a store of value

  • Ripple and Stellar have centralization issues

  • IOTA is a DAG, insecure, especially for significant amount of value
This positions dash as number one in it's niche, as a secure permission-less payment network. So please, stop obsessing over rank on CMC.

Now, I can understand the frustrations with the lack of info from Core, but totally defunding them is tantamount to self-harm unless we have a decent backup plan. Thus I propose, if after this call we are still not happy, that we mount a coordinated "A Ban Core Day" (ABCD) - we choose a day to vote them down for 24 hours, then vote them back in, thus sending them a clear message without actually hurting anyone.
 
Perspective of the top 11 on CMC:
  • Bitcoin and Litecoin are brothers, using old tech, blockchain 1.0

  • Bitcoin Cash and Dash are sisters, both forward looking and open to change, though Dash is superior for having an ongoing budget

  • Ethereum, Neo, Cardano, NEM and EOS are smart contracting systems whose main purpose is not a store of value

  • Ripple and Stellar have centralization issues

  • IOTA is a DAG, insecure, especially for significant amount of value
This positions dash as number one in it's niche, as a secure permission-less payment network. So please, stop obsessing over rank on CMC.

Now, I can understand the frustrations with the lack of info from Core, but totally defunding them is tantamount to self-harm unless we have a decent backup plan. Thus I propose, if after this call we are still not happy, that we mount a coordinated "A Ban Core Day" (ABCD) - we choose a day to vote them down for 24 hours, then vote them back in, thus sending them a clear message without actually hurting anyone.

I think the purpose isn't to actually defund them permanently, but rather withhold funding until demands have been met. His approach simply carries real threat while your approach is more of a gesture.
 
I think the purpose isn't to actually defund them permanently, but rather withhold funding until demands have been met. His approach simply carries real threat while your approach is more of a gesture.

A threat without a backup plan is worthwhile?

A well coordinated "gesture" would send a significant message. It would be the first time such event takes place and I have no doubt it would help to focus minds. It also buys us time to find an alternative path.
 
Incorrect, I don’t care about price - I am using coin market cap rank as a sentiment indicator of how our project is doing relative to other projects which provide proper updates and communication. Investors are starting to realize Dash core has not shown any substantial evidence that Evolution has made any progress from years ago.

Gaining trust and confidence of investors is an important piece to success. You of all people, as a PM should understand managing the expectations of a client and the importance of effective communication on a projects work in progress. The community has given core ample time (2 Years) to work on Evolution effectively with all budgets passed with little to no questions or proof of work. When would you say is a good time for the community to start asking for evidence? Another few years? The communication coordinator promised over 6 months ago still has not been provided. @Ryan Taylor. Some help here would be good.

I know you mean well, but I don’t think rank on CMC is indicative of anything — much less something really specific like communication strategy.

From there is it is a really BIG jump to assume that nothing is happening with Evo and start requesting proof of Core’s work.

Evo rollout was always slated for 2018. It is still the beginning of 2018. IMO, your arguments would make a lot more sense year or two from now.
 
A threat without a backup plan is worthwhile?

A well coordinated "gesture" would send a significant message. It would be the first time such event takes place and I have no doubt it would help to focus minds. It also buys us time to find an alternative path.

I don't disagree. Either way, I think it is a moot point since I very much either plan will have enough MN support to truly matter.
 
Coders are not communicators. Full Stop, Kot obviously hates the job and comes over as morose that completely defeats the purpose. Any Billion $ co's investors would have been up in arms by now. You have 2 excellent and POSITIVE communicators with Joel and Mark. Why don't you use them? Don't you trust them? Give them access. Feed them bits of info that won't reveal 'secrets'. Daily activities. Little progress. Problems encountered and solved. If you don't know what I'm talking about follow some of the other coins on twitter.
This is unacceptable! Frankly it is what you'll expect from an unorganised startup. I talk with a bunch of Dashers every week (that I introduced to Dash) and this is a recurring theme. Ryan - This is your responsibility! Do something! Not impressed at all! Palooka time....
 
I don't disagree. Either way, I think it is a moot point since I very much either plan will have enough MN support to truly matter.
well, I can put together at least 60 votes from my circle! I don't want to see DASH Core lose funding but I am willing to drum up all the no votes I can to have them pay us some basic respect in the way of communication and insight. This project is not just about what the sub DAO dash core wants and decides, In DASH we have a mechanism for the stakeholders to have a voice and this will be it. We don't have to be torn apart like bitcoin!
 
I would just like to see some more discussion about growth challenges. Many people in this industry understand that onboarding programmers does not benefit teams in the short term but it pays off over the longer term. In the short term it often slows things down more than otherwise.

Please also keep in mind dash core went from significantly underfunded to well funded in a year. Ideally you want to grow the team based on where you are going not where you are, so that is a unfortunate core couldn't staff up significantly in 2016 to prepare for 2017 and 2018.

And please don't pretend Dash is like other crypto's. Most hype crypto's are benefiting by copying features from bitcoin core or now the iota tangle tech and acting like it is a revolutionary upgrade. Somehow demoing instant transactions & lightning became interesting to the uniformed, when dash has had that for a long time. I see "substantial" news that come out on crypto's talking about their first wallets, Dash is so far beyond that. Everyone here is under agreement that Dash has a different roadmap then bitcoin and has significant engineering differences so if anything to be on the top you should be comparing dash to bitcoins development which is slow and tedious vs fast and reckless. Not long ago many were comparing Dash to PIVX which was hyping up a lot of features only to have their blockchain stop twice for many hours due to bugs. Luckily dash has the benefit of actually rolling out the finished code without that bitcoin like contention.
 
I would just like to see some more discussion about growth challenges. Many people in this industry understand that onboarding programmers does not benefit teams in the short term but it pays off over the longer term. In the short term it often slows things down more than otherwise.

Please also keep in mind dash core went from significantly underfunded to well funded in a year. Ideally you want to grow the team based on where you are going not where you are, so that is a unfortunate core couldn't staff up significantly in 2016 to prepare for 2017 and 2018.

And please don't pretend Dash is like other crypto's. Most hype crypto's are benefiting by copying features from bitcoin core or now the iota tangle tech and acting like it is a revolutionary upgrade. Somehow demoing instant transactions & lightning became interesting to the uniformed, when dash has had that for a long time. I see "substantial" news that come out on crypto's talking about their first wallets, Dash is so far beyond that. Everyone here is under agreement that Dash has a different roadmap then bitcoin and has significant engineering differences so if anything to be on the top you should be comparing dash to bitcoins development which is slow and tedious vs fast and reckless. Not long ago many were comparing Dash to PIVX which was hyping up a lot of features only to have their blockchain stop twice for many hours due to bugs. Luckily dash has the benefit of actually rolling out the finished code without that bitcoin like contention.
Don't get me wrong here, I am with DASH all the way and know this is the best digital cash solution in the market. When I made the comparison, it concerns the rift in the community. Bitcoin has been torn apart because devs want one thing and the community wants another; DASH should not have this issue because we can vote.
 
1) DASH may be "way ahead," but nobody knows...

2) A revolt? I'm probably the project's harshest critic, but in no way would I side with a revolt. Corrupt productivity is better than no productivity. If you discredit and remove them, who will do the job in their place? Most of them are not dirtbags anyway, just a few. I hold in my hands, absolute proof that would destroy this project. I've had it for a couple years. But, killing DASH is not what I want.

DASH used to be an obvious 11/10 when everything else was a 2/10 at best. Now, DASH is a 2.5/10 and everything else is still a 2/10. It's a lot like the USA, and white girls... Used to be awesome, but now, just slightly better than "meh..." And in the case of white girls, less than meh...

Having seen DASH fall from it's original great height gives us, who have been here to see the fall, a sour mood. Nobody else sees it, so they stay the same as always... But, as I reminded someone a few months ago... It's not as awesome as it used to be, but it's still the best thing going, even if there are a couple of dickheads in there willing to burn the whole thing down in a tantrum just to get their way, as more people get hired, the more dilute that is... I tried to push this bunch into action years ago, but I got tired of beating my head against a wall. They just plain don't get it and imagine themselves gods that already preside over all of crypto. They exist in a vacuum and will not tolerate a word from anyone to the contrary of the ivory tower echo chamber...

Save your breath. They won't listen or give a single fuck about anything that happens in reality. The circle-jerk is life...

DASH has survived purely on the spectacular idiocy of the rest of the market, but that luxury is rapidly coming to an end. All you can do is stay ready and keep your ear to the rail. If DASH manages to pull this out of the fire, it'll be nothing short of an entire stack of miracles. But, since I've watched a fair portion of that stack unfold already... I'm willing to keep betting on the streak...
 
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I am going to wait until Friday to see if the update is another general “we have done good work this quarter, thank you all for attending”.

With Evolution being closed source for 2 years, the community should instead be getting professional work in progress updates monthly to ensure investors are confident in their decision to place their money in this asset. Instead we have had silence for 2 years with delay after delay with the roadmap now out of date. The Dash DIPs were supposedly finalized from the Hong Kong meetup many months ago yet now they say the roadmap can’t be updated until the documentation is complete. Whatever that means. @AndyDark as the CTO and technical solution owner needs to step out of his comfort zone and start releasing some digestible information about Evolution to the public.

I am all for making Joel / Mark the official core communications team to investors. Core clearly doesn’t care enough about its investors to provide any relevant updates on a monthly basis. The monthly update reports needs to be aligned with the roadmap as that’s what Core is delivering against. Not just “we on boarded 1 developer” or “did not have enough info for this section”.

What billion dollar company do you know would release a monthly update report to its investors saying “not enough information provided from the team”.
 
From skimming through this thread, I think that the biggest issue seems to be communication and project management. But to be fair, this seems to be a common issue across the vast majority of Crypto projects I've seen. I've also had exposure to technology/development teams within the finance industry for many years and can tell you that given the complexity of technology and the development and testing process, it is very difficult task (although, not impossible) to give a definite deadline. It is also a juggle sometimes between releasing something on time and have bugs or delay and test to correct the bugs. Do you guys remember Windows ME, Windows Vista, Windows 8?

As a best practice I have seen among some Crypto projects, I would recommend the creation of blog with a weekly update on development progress. I am sure that behind the scenes they are working hard.
 
It would be more conducive to this thread's purpose if ya'all would write a clear question for core to answer, especially if you don't want your question lost in the arguing. Just a helpful hint ;)

My Questions based on above (if they haven't already been asked as I've already forgotten what's on the first pages, LOL) :

1. When will 12.3 be in open testnet?
2. When will 13 be in open testnet, or how long after 12.3 do you project it will take?
3. Finally, please guess how many beans are in this jar, thank you for your time.

clip_image0011.jpg


I have no f'ing idea, have a drink with me ;)
 
Just on a side note, I am meeting with a developer tomorrow who works on Bitcoin ATMs to discuss the feasibility of adding Dash. I will keep you guys posted and if all goes well, I will be putting together a proposal for funding through the DAO.
Sounds good, I am thinking about setting up a DASH atm network across Australia.
 
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