Dash Watch Renewal Pre-Proposal April 15 2018

[jimbursch]

I would like to kindly ask you to consider proposal as a product and not try to manage the internal team resources and salaries.

I would like to endorse that sentiment. We don't want to micro manage projects by committee, or even worse, micro manage by public criticism.

There is a concern I have with the Dash Watch project overall. The detailed financial reporting that is being sought seems to invite public micro management.

 

[Efietskop]

Hi! I'm Matt from Dash Watch, the full-time employee from the Netherlands. From now on I will continue as @MattDash #6481 on Discord, as Matt's my real name.

I would like to clarify that we (the reporting team) don't spend much of our time on "low skill work" like collecting widely available data. Most of our time is spent in keeping up with what's going on with proposals, design questionnaires/surveys to ask the proposal owners, interview proposal owners and turn the results into reports. We also still work a lot on improving our processes.

Reporting team members need to:
- Know their way around the Dash community and the workings of the treasury system;
- Be willing to occasionally work at unfavourable times to interview proposal owners all over the world;
- Be dependable, available and committed to the project, like in March we wrote 60 reports in about a week.*

Finding people that can deliver desired quality and fulfil these requirements was not easy. Forming the current team of 4 already took quite some effort.

As for myself. The past month, apart from writing reports, I also worked a lot on how we collect and process our data. We are handling data on almost 400 proposals and it is not an easy task to keep this data verified and traceable, and to keep it that way as we constantly update it. I already made significantly improvements to our processes, improving our data and increasing efficiency. And I will continue to improve it over the next few month. Feedback is always welcome though! Also, if you find an error in the data on our site, feel free to notify me here or on Discord.

I have a degree in engineering. I have been in the Dash community for about 6 months now. I want to contribute to the Dash ecosystem and am happy that through Dash Watch I can commit my full time on Dash. And as a bonus I can tell all my friends and family that I get paid in Dash!

*There's only a limited window to write reports. Not too early because the proposals need time to work after they received funding, but still in time to be read by MNO's before the voting deadline.

 

[DashWatchTeam]

I would like to endorse that sentiment. We don't want to micro manage projects by committee, or even worse, micro manage by public criticism.

There is a concern I have with the Dash Watch project overall. The detailed financial reporting that is being sought seems to invite public micro management.

Thank you for the feedback jimbursch.

We agree that micromanaging and demanding detailed financial breakdowns of particularly what people are getting paid may well be counter productive and we are open to continuing to improve what and how we ask for. At the same time, we have noticed the communities desire to get better financial accountability particularly from the larger proposals and want to find the right balance of information gathering while still respecting and not promoting a culture of micromanaging other peoples proposals.

 

[demo]

We agree that micromanaging and demanding detailed financial breakdowns of particularly what people are getting paid may well be counter productive

You should not demand from the proposal owners detailed financial breakdowns. You should automate them. This should be your task, as dashwatch team. You should offer (and introduce) to the proposal owners the appropriate tools and platforms, so that their detailed payments will automatically appear , and thus their data will be able to become subject of statistical analysis.
You should develop an e-cashier, and all proposal owners should be forced to use it, in order for all their transactions to be recorded.

 

[DashWatchTeam]

You should not demand from the proposal owners detailed financial breakdowns. You should automate them. This should be your task, as dashwatch team. You should offer (and introduce) to the proposal owners the appropriate tools and platforms, so that their detailed payments will automatically appear , and thus their data will be able to become subject of statistical analysis.

Hi demo, we already automate part of the process and are constantly looking for ways to improve automation. You take can a look at our latest survey questionnaire here: https://www.smartsurvey.co.uk/s/A8YCQ1/

However, it is not as simple as it may initially seem. The first being that proposal owners can provide as much or as little detail as possible in providing financial information - broad and vague details will need to be manually followed up by Dash Watch. Also, there's Dash to Fiat transactions, Dash paid directly transactions, Dash appreciation/depreciation of value, etc. We hope to improve and automate this process as best as we can in the upcoming months.

 

[demo]

Hi demo, we already automate part of the process and are constantly looking for ways to improve automation. You take can a look at our latest survey questionnaire here: https://www.smartsurvey.co.uk/s/A8YCQ1/
.

No questionnaires, no surveys. This is counter productive.
An e-cashier should be developed, and all proposal owners should be forced to use it when they pay, in order for all their transactions to be recorded.

 

[Argon31]

I still maintain that this proposal is expensive and the @DashWatchTeam has shown little interest in cutting excess costs.

 

[DashWatchTeam]

No questionnaires, no surveys. This is counter productive.
An e-cashier should be developed, and all proposal owners should be forced to use it when they pay, in order for all their transactions to be recorded.

Could you please elaborate on this? We can't force anything on proposal owners as we have a decentralized system. Furthermore, this sounds like it could be stepping into the the area of money transmission.

I still maintain that this proposal is expensive and the @DashWatchTeam has shown little interest in cutting excess costs.

As outlined in our survey, we can reduce the budget but it would come with a reduced scope. What are deliverables that are lower priorities to the community?

 

[demo]

Could you please elaborate on this? We can't force anything on proposal owners as we have a decentralized system. Furthermore, this sounds like it could be stepping into the the area of money transmission.

Of course you cannot enforce. Only the MNOs can enforce. The idea of an e-cashier requires a governement decision by the MNOs, and an implementation by the core team.

The MNOs should decide that all transactions made by all approved proposal owners, should obligatory be reported automatically, through the e-cashier system, to the DashwatchTeam.

 

[DashWatchTeam]

Of course you cannot enforce. Only the MNOs can enforce. The idea of an e-cashier requires a governement decision, on behalf of the MNOs.

The MNOs should decide that all transactions made by all approved proposal owners, should first be reported automatically, through the e-cashier system, to the DashwatchTeam.

We would be happy to assist in any way possible if that is what the Governance system wants. We'd just like to note that at this current point in time we are working within the bounds of what we can do.

 

[demo]

We would be happy to assist in any way possible if that is what the Governance system wants. We'd just like to note that at this current point in time we are working within the bounds of what we can do.

The bounds depend on and are set by your proposal.
There is no specific and separate governance system in Dash. The implementation proposals are mixed with the governance (which is a fundamental flaw of course).

Include the e-cashier idea in your proposal, and wait for the MNOs to decide about it.

 

[DashWatchTeam]

The bounds depend on and are set by your proposal.
There is no specific and separate governance system in Dash. The implementation proposals are mixed with the governance (which is a fundamental flaw of course).

Include the e-cashier idea in your proposal, and wait for the MNOs to decide about it.

We would need to flesh out the idea more. This is an idea that needs an entire proposal to itself as we imagine it would be contentious. Perhaps this is a proposal you can put in yourself?

 

[kot]

@DashWatchTeam - please do not limit yourself and scope of the good product because of one unsatisfied individual, who is probably not a MN owner.

Any comment is valuable and @Argon31 has the right to express his opinion, however you have a right (and duty) to make the best possible choices for the network and it doesn't mean that it has to be the cheapest possible choice. I am not suggesting to waste money, but to spend it wisely.

My grandfather used to say: one who buys very cheap products, pays twice.

 

[ilyass AJ]

Dash Watch helped dash community to know all about the project that's help us to stop the scammer .

 

[demo]

We would need to flesh out the idea more. This is an idea that needs an entire proposal to itself as we imagine it would be contentious. Perhaps this is a proposal you can put in yourself?

I cannot put a proposal because:

1. I have not 5 dash.
2. English is not my native language and I find very diffcult to express myself accurately in this language.

Thats why I am mostly involved in discussions into the forum. When I discuss, I dont need to be accurate. If I express something in a wrong linguistic way, people can ask again what I mean, and I can elaborate. Thats how I pass my ideas. I cannot do this in a proposal. A proposal requires for me to set something in stone, and this is very difficult for me to do it in a foreign language.

So I am here, i discuss with the people, hoping that they will understand my message and that I will convince them. If i manage to pass my spirit into the community, then someone will post a proposal similar to my ideas. During the two years I hang around, I have seen this happening more than once, and I am happy with it.

 

[DashWatchTeam]

@DashWatchTeam - please do not limit yourself and scope of the good product because of one unsatisfied individual, who is probably not a MN owner.

Any comment is valuable and @Argon31 has the right to express his opinion, however you have a right (and duty) to make the best possible choices for the network and it doesn't mean that it has to be the cheapest possible choice. I am not suggesting to waste money, but to spend it wisely.

My grandfather used to say: one who buys very cheap products, pays twice.

Very wise words. There's a lot more than meets the eye for keeping up to date with proposals progress and metrics. We are planning on releasing a video with our core team members to elaborate more on our work and so the community can meet the team on a more personal level.

 

[DashWatchTeam]

Dash Watch helped dash community to know all about the project that's help us to stop the scammer .

Thank you for your support!

 

[DashWatchTeam]

I cannot put a proposal because:

1. I have not 5 dash.
2. English is not my native language and I find very diffcult to express myself accurately in this language.

Thats why I am mostly involved in discussions into the forum. When I discuss, I dont need to be accurate. If I express something in a wrong linguistic way, people can ask again what I mean, and I can elaborate. Thats how I pass my ideas. I cannot do this in a proposal. A proposal requires for me to set something in stone, and this is very difficult for me to do it in a foreign language.

So I am here, i discuss with the people, hoping that they will understand my message and that I will convince them. If i manage to pass my spirit into the community, then someone will post a proposal similar to my ideas. During the two years I hang around, I have seen this happening more than once, and I am happy with it.

Understood. We're always open to feedback and constructive criticism. We do however have to manage a balance between community members and proposal owners. Proposal owner participation is completely voluntary and encouraged at this point in time, so if we are too unforgiving with our asks then we will have poor proposal owner participation. On the other hand, we want to get the more accurate and thorough information for the community.

 

[Arthyron]

@Argon31 is a known troll in virtually every thread he participates. He's only been "participating" since February and showed up out of the blue being rude to everyone and ignoring any questions about himself and his behavior and stake in Dash, something about which I've perpetually accosted him. Most of what he says can thus be summarily ignored, don't waste your time responding to him.

As a MNO myself and someone very active across multiple platforms, I've seen several members of your team actively working and providing updates and corrections and other kinds of valuable information on a regular basis. More than that, what has impressed me about your work is that you've done so in a very objective, unbiased manner, providing information without opinion. What you do is a huge service to what the rest of us do, and given that and how you plan to alter the scope of your service, I think your asking price is fairly reasonable. I would urge you to wait until the next budget cycle, of course and to submit early to increase your chances of being funded simply because of the carry over this month from previous cycles and the fact that the beginning of this cycle came at a low point in Dash price. Next cycle should hopefully have much more room, but other than that, you will have my support. I don't mind that your workers are paid generously, just try to keep your costs from escalating too much the way some proposals do, and keep coordinating with and adding value to the other proposals we fund and I foresee a long-standing partnership.

 

[Dash-Al]

@Argon31 is a known troll in virtually every thread he participates. He's only been "participating" since February and showed up out of the blue being rude to everyone and ignoring any questions about himself and his behavior and stake in Dash, something about which I've perpetually accosted him. Most of what he says can thus be summarily ignored, don't waste your time responding to him.

As a MNO myself and someone very active across multiple platforms, I've seen several members of your team actively working and providing updates and corrections and other kinds of valuable information on a regular basis. More than that, what has impressed me about your work is that you've done so in a very objective, unbiased manner, providing information without opinion. What you do is a huge service to what the rest of us do, and given that and how you plan to alter the scope of your service, I think your asking price is fairly reasonable. I would urge you to wait until the next budget cycle, of course and to submit early to increase your chances of being funded simply because of the carry over this month from previous cycles and the fact that the beginning of this cycle came at a low point in Dash price. Next cycle should hopefully have much more room, but other than that, you will have my support. I don't mind that your workers are paid generously, just try to keep your costs from escalating too much the way some proposals do, and keep coordinating with and adding value to the other proposals we fund and I foresee a long-standing partnership.

Thanks for your feedback! I appreciate that you recognize the value in what Dash Watch is doing as well as the long term potential. Personally, I can speak to the fact that we are putting in a lot of hours right not developing and optimizing our systems and methods. I don't think anything like this sort of accountability for DAO funded proposals has ever been done so initially a lot of time has to be put in figuring this all out. I'm not afraid to say that we do not have everything figured out right now! There's still many aspects of Dash Watch we are working on improving, and we could use the most help from the community in terms of feedback - what things should we be prioritizing, what metrics matter and what don't, etc. So I believe that the budget ask should go down or maintain current levels once we really start catching our stride, so to speak.

I would also like to emphasize the potential that Dash Watch has with synergizing with other proposals. In our pre-proposal we already laid out an overview of working with projects such as Dash Boost, Dash Intel, Dash Nexus, and Dash Remix. Beyond that the work we do at Dash Watch would be immensely helpful to escrow providers in saving some of the work they do. I believe you responded to my other forum post about the escrow services with Good Attorney's at Law - Dash Watch and Firm's services are a natural marriage.