A Potential Goldmine: Making The #FirstDashWallet Campaign Permanent

[TroyDASH]

About diluting the supply. Creating an additional 1000 dash per month is equivalent to about 0.01% of the trading volume for the month and also represents about 0.01% of the total coin supply. Even if almost the entire amount is dumped, if it produces at least 0.01% gain then it has positive ROI for the network.

 

[Dashmaximalist]

You guys need to start treating the Treasury with more respect. Business decisions here are being made by people with no business experience. Whether a campaign is successful is not a subjective matter, the decision to spend everyone's money isn't subject to how you FEEL about it. Read what UdjinM6 said:



@GrandMasterDash, @Jmmon, @TroyDASH , @TaoOfSatoshi (and even @amanda_b_johnson) haven't provided, so far, any evidence that this campaign is "successful". Again, if 1 MILLION newbies signup, are you going to just give then $20 MILLION DOLLARS for installing an app on their phone? This is a ridiculous idea and if you want to challenge that, present the fact not your opinions.

Here is a list of things that are NOT facts or don't objectively support this campaign:

• getting dash "out there" (what does that even mean?)
• getting people talking about dash (subjective)
• "Amanda is one of the great innovators in Dash" (that's an opinion and doesn't support anything)
• "Dash's budget needs to be fully re-invested" (that's also an opinion and I can easily challenge that)

Here is a list of OBJECTIVE facts as examples:

• E-commerce spending $1 per click on google ads with a conversion rate of 3% because it earns $100 for every $70 spent.
• UBER offering $30 per ride because they already have a product for the market and models indicate ROI in 6 months.
• Paypal offering $10 per account because they already have a product for the market and models indicate ROI in 6 months.

Can you spot the difference?

1. Dash doesn't have a product. I'm in the USA and can't spend Dash anywhere.
2. Dash isn't ready for the market. The product that is ready for the market is called Evolution guys.
3. Companies doing this have precise metrics to measure ROI.
4. Those companies doing this have a fiduciary response with their investors. Do you want to spend the funds and dilute the currency supply just because the funds are there? Absolutely NOT!

Dash's treasury needs to be treated with more respect and responsibility!

its looks like you are thinking in a slightly wrong direction , the key different between uber and dash , dash is money , uber is just a product.

dash can be used in 1000 ways, but the most important thing for money is NETWORK , and building that network is very very hard

imagine 1 billion people have opened wallets , you would say 20 billion dumped right , absolutely wrong , if 1 billion people open a dash wallet

dash will replace fucking US dollar in 1 year or less, its takes a lot of money to build the pipes for digital cash and once those pipes are built lots of things will happen

do you know the biggest users of bitcoin have been from nigeria , india , venezuela , indonesia etc , do you know why ?

yes they are developing countries , their currencies are screwed up , but these are the people that use crypto day in day out not people like me who just pile up dash

we need dash to get out there , if it costs a bit of money thats fine.

i reckon $20 is bit too high , we can probably pay like $5 but yes we need people to open wallets and use them

we need MLMs to run on dash not on expensive bitcoin

Its 100x times better to get dash to used for people to open their first wallet than be burned in hell

 

[RGXDK]

About diluting the supply. Creating an additional 1000 dash per month is equivalent to about 0.01% of the trading volume for the month and also represents about 0.01% of the total coin supply. Even if almost the entire amount is dumped, if it produces at least 0.01% gain then it has positive ROI for the network.

The flaw in this logic is assuming the value of Dash will stay constant. 5 years from now, all this Dash being spent on irrelevant things (acrobatics, dash t-shirts, $20 to install an app, mma fighters) will taste as sour as the 10,000 BTC pizza. By being responsible with other people's money we will not dilute the currency supply in the future and we can focus on the majors.

 

[ampp]

I think everyone is a bit lost of what cryptocurrency is right now. I've said this on slack a few times that crypto only has to be a good store of value (right now). Dash is as much of a store of value as any other crypto and probably better than bitcoin soon. The ecosystem does not care about technology right now. While it is important to improve upon that the act of bringing people into Dash can be separate from the current features and does not need to wait on the next feature release.

I'm for aggressive strategies but i prefer a first dash wallet that is tied to a purchase. Much like coinbase if you refer someone you both get $10 worth of bitcoin. That way both parties are able to purchase more. I feel that a large number of people with dash first wallet may not ever go on and buy a Dash until mainstream adoption anyway. However if only a few percent do we are still doing something.

 

[Dashmaximalist]

The flaw in this logic is assuming the value of Dash will stay constant. 5 years from now, all this Dash being spent on irrelevant things (acrobatics, dash t-shirts, $20 to install an app, mma fighters) will taste as sour as the 10,000 BTC pizza. By being responsible with other people's money we will not dilute the currency supply in the future and we can focus on the majors.

ok you suggest people simply hoard dash not spend on anything, thats absolutely foolish , if there is no trading , no spending , a currency will die

Currency has two important features , the first its a good store of value the more important one is that its easy to trade ( aka spending ) without transactions happening no one will buy into a currency if no one buys into a currency the value is basically zero

Its funny but thats how currencies work

Saying that hoarding is the best thing to do is riduculous , remember this it doesnt take much to clone the best crpyo in few clicks

whats gives networth to a currency is its network remember that and networks consists of people who spend as well those who invest / hoard

 

[RGXDK]

ok you suggest people simply hoard dash not spend on anything, thats absolutely foolish , if there is no trading , no spending , a currency will die

Currency has two important features , the first its a good store of value the more important one is that its easy to trade ( aka spending ) without transactions happening no one will buy into a currency if no one buys into a currency the value is basically zero

Its funny but thats how currencies work

Saying that hoarding is the best thing to do is riduculous , remember this it doesnt take much to clone the best crpyo in few clicks

whats gives networth to a currency is its network remember that and networks consists of people who spend as well those who invest / hoard

I am explicitly talking about treasury; trading between individuals of a network has nothing to do with treasury.
I wrote "being responsible with treasury" and you understood it as "you suggest people simply hoard dash not spend on anything".
I never even used the word hoarding

 

[Dashmaximalist]

ok but we have to spend the treasury amount today even if the price goes up 100x in 5 years whatever , we need to spend it out to get the word about dash , thats what is needed

i reckon we should get best ROI for our spending , but remember we need to spend first to get the ROI

lets face it , this whole $20 thing is not such a bad idea , its might be the best coz we could probably just give $10 or even $5 tbh

but its far better than letting the coins burn

 

[amanda_b_johnson]

Hello, everyone.

I'm happy to see that so many well-respected long-timers as well as newcomers have taken the time to discuss this campaign. That is a great sign to me.

Firstly, for anyone who cares to review the raw participant and payments data -- there are over 2000 entries as of now -- here is our spreadsheet: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1SMvHjloOlKpWo4SyTA9h_Me0UUOXmUhxScekNljiWCc/edit?usp=sharing

You'll notice that the first tab is Facebook, second is Twitter, and third is called "Scrape[_]," which is the batch of Twitter scrapes currently being processed, soon to be moved to the "Twitter" tab once paid.

Speaking of "scrapes," I'll take this space to confirm -- in case anyone was wondering -- that @dashdisciple has indeed been providing constant and ample assistance to Pete and myself in making this campaign possible. After about day three or four, we realized we were in over our heads. Dashdisciple reached out, and within 24 hours, set an employee of his to deploy a remote Twitter scraper and batch payment tool for us to use. Dashdisciple has also spent several hours with me on the phone, providing advice when I required it (for questions like, "How should we deal with this specific type of entry?", etc.)

Beyond that, Dashdisciple and I had already been communicating almost daily over the past 3 weeks -- ever since he became "public" here in Dashland. I find myself requiring guidance and support in navigating the world of media, and though I don't know his real-life identity, I have found his advice and support to be quite valuable. I have no reason to doubt that he is a "Dash whale," because he's refused every attempt I've made to pay him or his programmer employee for their assistance.

Regarding this particular campaign -- Dashdisciple and I agreed that were it to get any mainstream media coverage, it should continue. Despite offering a large bounty, reaching out to Wachsman PR (the Core team's PR firm), and personally sending over a dozen emails to known cryptocurrency reporters, still no bite.

For this reason -- and because the entries are becoming more group-specific by the day -- I'll close this particular campaign today, while leaving things open for another campaign in the future. Whether it will be a #FirstDashWallet one or something slightly different, I've not yet decided. More analysis of the results of this one, combined with a strategy to make fraud-detection more automated, will be required before deploying another campaign.

What I do know, is that it worked.

Thank you, everyone, for your feedback and support.

 

[TanteStefana]

This was written before I saw Amanda's post above.

1. In all honesty, I really miss Amanda's shows. I don't think she can do her shows and spend her manual labor / 100% of her waking time doing this. Worse, If she's not burning out, I'd be surprised!

2. It would be better if another group took over, like Dash Force or something, and if they could poke at Amanda and Pete's genius/creativity for new angles, that'd be awesome.

3. I disagree with Andy. The core team are so conservative, it is pretty disappointing. But then again, the rest of us have got to learn that to be decentralized, we need to make other core teams, and demand they work together.

Why I disagree with Andy is that Dash is a startup that will not burn through the funds in the traditional way, as @dashdisciple pointed out, the article Andy linked does not pertain to Dash. However, doing this right will require a lot more labor. We shouldn't waste talent (Amanda and Pete) on something like this.

Now, for my reasons why funds SHOULD be used to grow Dash (whatever way we can come up with) even if Evolution is not ready yet:

Volume and Price. We need to grow volume and spread Dash to as many people as possible if we want it to be usable without huge jumps in in price. I argue that campaigns to increase users is closer to organic growth than big announcements and sudden spike in prices, then panic sell offs because the spike is unnatural looking.

I don't care what people do with their Dash after they get it, it's theirs, though a program analyzing what happens would be really cool.

My suggestion would be for either Dash Force (if so inclined) and Amanda and Pete to get together and build a DAO to take this campaign forward, hire the people they need, and oversee it a bit until they feel comfortable handing the reins off to a person in charge Thgis could be the start of a "marketing core team"

Dash Core is operating INSIDE THE BOX, but Dash has no box. It's sad.

 

[Dashmaximalist]

This was written before I saw Amanda's post above.

1. In all honesty, I really miss Amanda's shows. I don't think she can do her shows and spend her manual labor / 100% of her waking time doing this. Worse, If she's not burning out, I'd be surprised!

2. It would be better if another group took over, like Dash Force or something, and if they could poke at Amanda and Pete's genius/creativity for new angles, that'd be awesome.

3. I disagree with Andy. The core team are so conservative, it is pretty disappointing. But then again, the rest of us have got to learn that to be decentralized, we need to make other core teams, and demand they work together.

Why I disagree with Andy is that Dash is a startup that will not burn through the funds in the traditional way, as @dashdisciple pointed out, the article Andy linked does not pertain to Dash. However, doing this right will require a lot more labor. We shouldn't waste talent (Amanda and Pete) on something like this.

Now, for my reasons why funds SHOULD be used to grow Dash (whatever way we can come up with) even if Evolution is not ready yet:

Volume and Price. We need to grow volume and spread Dash to as many people as possible if we want it to be usable without huge jumps in in price. I argue that campaigns to increase users is closer to organic growth than big announcements and sudden spike in prices, then panic sell offs because the spike is unnatural looking.

I don't care what people do with their Dash after they get it, it's theirs, though a program analyzing what happens would be really cool.

My suggestion would be for either Dash Force (if so inclined) and Amanda and Pete to get together and build a DAO to take this campaign forward, hire the people they need, and oversee it a bit until they feel comfortable handing the reins off to a person in charge Thgis could be the start of a "marketing core team"

Dash Core is operating INSIDE THE BOX, but Dash has no box. It's sad.

well said , we have arguably best currency in the world yet the growth is slow , the reason is simple , we have bad / non cohesive marketing team or in my opinion no team at all

We need a strong marketing core team or else our ranking and mark cap will not shoot up to the stars

 

[TaoOfSatoshi]

@amanda_b_johnson Way to go, Amanda. You've shown us that we can create passion for Dash through these types of campaigns. Wish you the best of luck in future campaigns.

@AndyDark I fully agree with you that it would be better to have Evolution underway before we dive into a campaign like this, but it was started already. However, I disagree with your approach of treating this man @dashdisciple who's done nothing but good for Dash since he's shown up, and makes valid points. We all see things from different viewpoints, and it would do us well to try and see things from many different angles, instead of immediately going into attack mode. We are all Dash, and I too am thankful for your work.

@dashdisciple Thanks for all your help, I'm sure we will be ready to take the next step when we all work together, as is the Dash Nation way!

Great discussion. Let the passion flow, because we all love this project, and are like a big global family.

 

[TanteStefana]

Not talking about this particular campaign, it's worthiness etc... but I do feel that the Dash Core team have become far to conservative. Dash is so far outside the box on traditional wisdom, I fear that not only Dash Core but many, if not at least half of MN owners are constrained by their schooling. I think even printing out all our Dash budget onto paper wallets and "air dropping" them is a better solution than letting them burn. Yes, I do. We need to get it through our collective heads that funding Dash has NOTHING to do with funding a corporation / start up / anything ever faced in the history of mankind. Well, maybe a little more to d with the Space Program in the USA geting the first man on the moon. That's the closest thing.

Outside the box, people, outside is a whole new universe! Forget the inside, that's well known and established! We can't do anything new inside that claustrophobic box!

 

[SimontheRavager]

This was a very great campaign and i do not see why we should not repeat that every 3 or 4 month again. It can become an regularly campaign aka institution for us. I would also like to see Amanda be free for new things again. She had a hell lot of work to do so please give her a few days off ^^ We is so creative, just let her work.

 

[IronVape]

IIRC on Jan 1st we were n the $14-$17 range. Now core team is catchimg flack for not spending money fast enough? Nobody was prepared for this size budget this soon. It will take a while for the ecosystem to adjust to it (assuming it remains). But we will adjust.

Let's just keep moving forward. Let's try to keep the community unified. Let's disagree respectfully.

When in doubt... Vote on it.

 

[ampp]

When in doubt... Vote on it.

It would be easier to vote if the proposal fee wasn't 5 dash, or $910 as of today.

The conversation died at $70 and now it's even more of a problem.

Lets all remember, growing pains are good problems to have.

 

[stellabelle]

I also see the huge value in this social media campaign. I think an effective way to leverage it would be to have it for one week per month, every month. That way it builds up momentum, and also creates exposure for Dash on Twitter and everywhere else. Having it for a week long campaign builds up energy, so I can see that it's a really good way to get people to follow Amanda on Twitter, and create excitement.

 

[ampp]

@AndyDark I fully agree with you that it would be better to have Evolution underway before we dive into a campaign like this, but it was started already. However, I disagree with your approach of treating this man @dashdisciple who's done nothing but good for Dash since he's shown up, and makes valid points. We all see things from different viewpoints, and it would do us well to try and see things from many different angles, instead of immediately going into attack mode. We are all Dash, and I too am thankful for your work.

I think it's fair to question a new person. There are a lot of people who have been through the ringer that spent a long time building a valid reputation in this community. Releasing a site and doing a lot of work is not a ticket to trustworthiness. If it is we are going to get a lot of surprise projects. It is a very good first step. My only issue with releasing a utility site is if someone else was also working on it there would be a duplication of effort. And why not announce the project is getting worked on before and then over deliver rather than surprise. Anyway that's not very important at the moment.

There are many ways to read into the messages between andy and dashdiscipline. It's not in good taste to say or imply that you are responsible for investors or growth of dash. People want proof when those things get said. I'm also not in agreement with the perspective that core needs to grow faster as the growth rate is quite fast already. Growing programing teams is a technical difficulty as well as a management difficulty and can only be done so fast. Putting pressure on core is a very investor minded concept, the DAO is made for decentralized horizontal growth. However trust is the primary limitation here and right now dashtreasury only helps with after the fact housekeeping rather than beforehand escrow, usd payout and/or price protections which some group needs to take on sooner or later. And a very small group of people are trusted enough to handle hundreds of thousands in dash.

I could easily list many different incentive based projects we can be working on right now and i'll probably do that in another thread. If you guys really want to eat the budget up.

 

[Jed Clampett]

I just watched your #FirstDashWallet videos today, and I am impressed. I've been out of the crypto-space for a while, but the DJIA hitting 20,000 drew me back in... I get the feeling that this is going to be the summer of cryptocurrencies. I see subscription-based services giving away paper wallets with $20 BTC/ETH or $50 BTC during livestreams on YouTube. The last one I saw required viewers to leave a comment during the livestream and share the video on FB, Twitter, or Steemit.

 

[solarguy]

"Please ask Solarguy"


Thanks so much for the compliment. Been a bit hectic for me for a couple days. Had to fix two sink holes at church. Sometimes the real world intrudes into my Dash universe.

I will look over the thread tomorrow for a bit deeper analysis, but here are my initial thoughts:

1. I trust Amanda B. Johnson and will listen hard to her further thoughts regarding this matter of excess or unspent budget and expanding the current project x 10 or 100. Amanda got me seriously interested in Dash, and this is a familiar story. I think this latest strategy has been successful at producing new users, far exceeding Amanda's expectations.

There is this phenomenon that credit card companies lavish a lot of goodies on new college students to entice them to get their first credit card. It has been demonstrated that even though they may go on to get 5 other credit cards later on, they show unusual devotion to "their first". This is what Amanda is doing. I am in favor of it. Does it need to be increased to 10x or 1000 x the size? I don't know. Not sure frankly how to even do that.

2. I trust Tao, he has played such an integral role in giving the Dash community a goal; to be supportive. To argue your point, and argue it with passion and power, but be respectful. If the community succeeds, Dash succeeds. I am going to give every idea he proposes, serious consideration.

3. The idea that burning the un-allocated Dash budget is a waste, this idea has come up repeatedly, and there is substantial truth there. At its root, I think it springs from a deep seated, almost unconscious recognition of how rare and valuable and innovative Dash is. Yes, burning it makes the remaining coins more valuable. Mathematically, I totally get that. But emotionally, the question just keeps coming up, "Is that the best we can do with the excess? Burn it?"

And legitimately, sometimes the answer is yes. I don't want to fund crazy silly stupid last minute ideas. Ineffective and makes us look stupid. One way to avoid burning the excess is to build a slush fund that could be directed to special projects or unexpected expenses, or saving up for a superbowl ad. If the slush fund is too complex and risky, then we could develop of list of special projects.

Companies that have highly variable and unpredictable incomes solve that problem by budgeting the base amount that they have to have to stay open (and that they can generally count on getting). This category consists of "must haves" like payroll, rent for the office space, electric bill.

But, they also have a long list that prioritizes what to do after they have the basics covered. If they get an extra 10 grand, they do the first extra project. If they get another extra 17 grand, they go to the next special project. The list of special projects is always long enough to absorb the highest imaginable jackpot of extra funding. We could develop such a list.

I would challenge the Core team, and Amanda and Piet, and Tao and Mastermined and all the masternodes, and everybody that cares about Dash to contribute to that list.

I'll just throw out some examples to stimulate your imagination.(just unrefined examples, I'm not lobbying for these necessarily):

Identify a high powered advertising company that specializes in social media campaigns. Give them a down payment to think about what the big roll out would look like once Evolution comes on line. That just does not happen overnight. User experience surveys, focus groups, artwork etc etc etc. A good and effective campaign will takes months of work and research. Holy Crap! Better start now. We could "interview" three different firms and have some time to make a thoughtful selection so we are ready.

Hire a fantastic lawyer and/or accountant to look after or supervise the unique needs and risks of being a Masternode owner.

Identify the three most influential cryptocurrency advocacy groups (CoinCenter? Electronic Frontier Foundation? P2P?) and throw some support their way to help influence policy making and legislation so our fine legislators don't make stupid and clumsy mistakes that set the whole ecosystem back.

Hire our own Dash lobbyest to develop a relationship with the shakers and movers in Washington. I want crypto as a whole to succeed, but I want Dash at the top of the mountain.

Fund some nifty research into some aspect of the Dash ecosystem by talented researchers at Cornell, or MIT, or wherever the hotbed of crypto research is these days. Maybe the Core Team has some question they don't have the time or expertise to answer, but know somebody who could do the research. Good academic papers would add a definite sense of legitimacy and cutting edge flair to the Dash endeavor.

We the Masternodes could hire our own genius person who is gifted at finding out about x, y or z nitty gritty details about complex technical proposals. Almost like a private investigator that specializes in crypto. We all hate getting scammed, this would reduce scams.

Put up a big fat juicy bounty to figure out a decentralized escrow system for the Treasury that does not require trust in a 3rd party. this would add so much accountability to the proposal process, and we just do not have that feature right now. Maybe this is a new full time person for the core Dev team. I have a feeling if we put up a quarter of a million dollars, somebody would find an elegant and effective way to get that done.

Identify and support the 3 most influential people or groups who are trying to fix the terrible state of banking in most developing nations. There are some brilliant and motivated people working in this space. (to me, helping the unbanked and the underbanked is a sure fire slam dunk road to take Dash to the moon) This would enable the regular folks to make their personal situation, and their whole country, better in a hurry. This is the antithesis of charity. This is gathering people and resources and groups who already have insight into what the developing nations need in regards to personal finance all the way up to system wide reform (or replacement). Then we fill that need with Dash and go to the moon doing it.

Enable Amanda and Piet to do whatever they think up next. their exclusive slush fund to push Dash. Did I mention that I trust Amanda?

__________________________________ you fill in the blank with 89 creative amazing things that push the Dash ecosystem to greater adoption.

Having a systematic plan for those excess funds (and how to trigger them at the last minute) insures that we don't have to burn it, which isn't wasting it exactly, but isn't putting it to maximum use either.

Developing a list like that also raises the bar for the rest of the proposals. Whatever the proposal is, at the very least, it has to be better than paying our lobbyist to educate senators and finance committees so Washington doesn't do a big stupid. etc etc etc.[/QUOTE]

 

[Vedran Yoweri]

"Until the day that Core realizes that this surplus money needs to be reinvested into aggressive outreach and marketing to new investors"

Total BS. Second hand car sales man attitude.

Core's strategy is based on the recognition that Dash (and crypto in general) is not ready for the mass market yet due to lack of access, usibility and complexity. To solve this we are working on Evolution, which you can read about in many places, and progress on that is (we feel) good and on schedule.

Wise.

Mass/agressive marketting before we have a mainstream product is something certain new people have been pushing agressively, and is something that is potentially very damanging to Dash before it can deliver the kind of value those users are looking for, and people are openly talking about how this can raise the price, i.e. driven by greed, and desire to increase the value of their Dash before we have a mainstream product and to new users who don't necessarily understand what they are taking on and potentially get burned if this kind of agressive marketing causes bubbles / large price rises, which again is damanging to our long term strategy and desire to actually benefit a much larger base of users in the mainstream than crypto is currently capable of doing.

Fooling noobs is the worst we could do. And we are doing it on a massive scale. nice guys.
Fucking indawoods all over again. Amateurs.